tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13084425.post3384660413739799940..comments2024-03-06T12:52:47.385-05:00Comments on Circus Tent - הירשל ציג'ס בלאג: HesitantHirshel Tzig - הירשל ציגhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/08911009966581004937noreply@blogger.comBlogger43125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13084425.post-64704205751496926312008-01-30T06:13:00.000-05:002008-01-30T06:13:00.000-05:00I read Asaf's book without deos kdumos.never heard...I read Asaf's book without deos kdumos.never heard about it from anyone. My impression was that even though he is not frum but he doesn't put in any 'geeft'.just states the facts and on this he should be nizkar leshvach.of course we can be dan him that there is no toeles in bringing up these yedios. Why R' Yitzchok Nachum wrote what he wrote, could be because of your pshat or something else. but it doesn't look to me as you said that 'er hut zich genumen tzu em'.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13084425.post-9524335684944384232008-01-09T16:16:00.000-05:002008-01-09T16:16:00.000-05:00I didn't have time for proper iyun in the comments...I didn't have time for proper iyun in the comments. But I must say that the book turned some of those with apikursusheh thoughts into maaminim from the scientific. The paper that says he shmad r"l is a "hetek" not an original. The Church then (and now) only had a "[handwritten] copy". So a yid like "Halavan" [I can't vouch for his personal opinions but I have a hunch that he wasn't always so convinced] says that maybe he just had regular [mental] illness. That is what the Mittler Rebbe writes. These are rayos listor asaff... He has several other books. Nice research, conclusions are quite opinionated.... {If I may add apikurshessly his earlier version [in Iton Tzion} was more convincing.... }Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13084425.post-67284286144193093692008-01-06T03:47:00.000-05:002008-01-06T03:47:00.000-05:00ddCan you elaborate on what Berel L. holds today?I...dd<BR/>Can you elaborate on what Berel L. holds today?<BR/>I saw sometime ago on the Atsor Kahn Choshvim that he was arguing with him.Berel was very emotional so he came across as not viewing the story based on what appeared to be the facts.<BR/>However, I'm not to 'bahavent' in the story so I cannot vouch although even as a child I understood that there was some story there so I wasen't very surprised by Assafs bookAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13084425.post-84303710087287155292008-01-05T19:21:00.000-05:002008-01-05T19:21:00.000-05:00halavan Aka B.L ,today agrees with the Asaf versio...halavan Aka B.L ,today agrees with the Asaf version of Reb Moshe conversion.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13084425.post-66664484106930115272008-01-04T15:05:00.000-05:002008-01-04T15:05:00.000-05:00On Atzur (Hyde Park)Halban answered him in a profe...On Atzur (Hyde Park)Halban answered him in a professional manner but he answered very weakAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13084425.post-39721761220434467382008-01-04T12:39:00.000-05:002008-01-04T12:39:00.000-05:00Guravitzer,you really think the letter with signat...Guravitzer,<BR/>you really think the letter with signatures of the miteler rebbee and his brother are forgeries?.<BR/>or you just dont know what i am talking about?.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13084425.post-85518847721213919872008-01-04T10:17:00.000-05:002008-01-04T10:17:00.000-05:00Neveler@gmail.com? Interesting email address for ...Neveler@gmail.com? Interesting email address for a Hungarian.chchickhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05527049307499856338noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13084425.post-21725655621125828462008-01-04T09:49:00.000-05:002008-01-04T09:49:00.000-05:00you may ask: why did I allow a comment calling me...you may ask: why did I allow a comment calling me a Z----h to pass through unedited?<BR/><BR/>Simple.<BR/><BR/>This 2-bit <EM>Apikores</EM> proves my point, that it's not about finding out the "truth," it's all about making us look bad, and dragging in molestation into the conversation.Hirshel Tzig - הירשל ציגhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08911009966581004937noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13084425.post-72596289591471558112008-01-04T08:50:00.000-05:002008-01-04T08:50:00.000-05:00Growing up Chasidish I heard many stories against ...Growing up Chasidish I heard many stories against other chasidic courts.In fact the real machloikes was between the various chasidic groups once the flaring fights with the Misnagdim quitened down and that was early on.<BR/>Breslev was actively persecuted,Rizhin and Tzanz had a worldwar and a bit later on Aleksander and Ger were fighting over turf.<BR/>Actually is that any different than we see today? Satmar vs Lubavitch pretty recent vintage, Satmar vs Bnei Yoel , vs themselves, Klausenburg vs Klausenburg.The list is too long.<BR/>The world is very much the same today as it was than.Human nature has remained the sameAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13084425.post-83972750863182237742008-01-04T03:25:00.000-05:002008-01-04T03:25:00.000-05:00I wonder what a book written by a zoyneh like you ...I wonder what a book written by a zoyneh like you describing Mondrowitz would look like?<BR/>You would be full of how special he was how he 'loved' every child, (especially zechurem) etc.<BR/>How all the stories were biased and made up.<BR/>Right.<BR/>Actually that's what happened! Zoynehs like you seeking to 'defend' their hoif attacked kids trying to complain about the abuse.<BR/>Same story with Kolko.<BR/>Same story with so many Rebbes,rebbelach, banshakim and stam frimmeh zoiness like you.<BR/>The truth must be so scary that you have to make up bubbeh mayses, that you feel that it shvachs up your emunas chachomim.<BR/>Continue with the same old liesAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13084425.post-6540077237281261182008-01-03T20:54:00.000-05:002008-01-03T20:54:00.000-05:00"why do you so easily accept as fact the harrasmen..."why do you so easily accept as fact the harrasment of the brexlover by the chernobler rebbes?"<BR/><BR/>To HT, there are facts (things that he believes to be true, or agrees with), and 'facts' (which he doesn't believe or agree with).<BR/><BR/>The concept of Emmess doesn't enter the picture in either category.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13084425.post-40134049096564538272008-01-03T19:15:00.000-05:002008-01-03T19:15:00.000-05:00HirshelI didnt read this book but I read his other...Hirshel<BR/>I didnt read this book but I read his other kiss& tell book on the holy Ruzhiner, he tries to portray him as a Dictator ( Rodan in Hebrew) he bases alot of his info on maskilim as 1 guy that used to be a chosid of the Bnie Yissoscher that left the fold and became a vicous chasidim basher with all the biases. Asaf admids that the guy is biased but that doesent stop him from quoting him as the legit source vs. chasidim as for instance the Tehila Ledovid that was a godol betorah and never said a lie in his lifetime, but he was he was biased since he was a chosid, this false academic notion is a given in all academic circles.<BR/>He would never answer how giants and geniuses like the Chidusie Harim, the Sanzer and the Tzemach Tzedek were in awe of his greatness their philosophy was total different, and there were no materialistic gains for them in the Ruzhiners court, so why all the admiration? and a menuvel like him cant fathom that there was Elukis that they felt in his dalet amusAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13084425.post-47887064791441148402008-01-03T17:14:00.001-05:002008-01-03T17:14:00.001-05:00The pnimi story is what I referred to. No idea as ...The pnimi story is what I referred to. No idea as to veracity. But certainly a more definite form of suicide.Guravitzerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09903833477421514457noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13084425.post-44051176848622004542008-01-03T17:14:00.000-05:002008-01-03T17:14:00.000-05:00Objective Onlooker said... "FACT, moshe was a mesh...Objective Onlooker said... <BR/>"FACT, moshe was a meshumad no matter what the reason.<BR/>FACT, chabad tried to cover up."<BR/>Ha Ha. It's a fact because the Russian Orthodox Church told you so? Very sweet. They also tell you jesus rose from the dead to save you. Go shmad zich now, they have the documents to prove it.<BR/><BR/>Where is the Chabad coverup? The FR told the story as he knew it. No one withheld anything. It's call the denial of Chabad. Words have meaning, kemedubar.Guravitzerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09903833477421514457noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13084425.post-37519948882060801462008-01-03T16:41:00.000-05:002008-01-03T16:41:00.000-05:00Prizant - True I never read THE BOOK. But most of ...Prizant - True I never read THE BOOK. But most of the book 's chapters werer previously published in various Israeli academic journals like ZION MEKHKERE YERUSHALAYIM and ALPAIIM among others . So I did read any number of these essays in their original place of publication. The article about the son in law of the 3rd Belzer rav was striclty lekanter an attack on Belz. The article on Rabbi M son of the Tanya is the same . Many of us knew about this but who had the gumption, chutzpah or pleitzes to write about it. Would you and I want someone to write about an ancestor of ours in Russia who became a priest. Only if it had a didactic significance. Otherwise it just garbage.\<BR/>Be well.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13084425.post-4671995278762457802008-01-03T16:09:00.000-05:002008-01-03T16:09:00.000-05:00A year ago, when the book was being heavily debate...A year ago, when the book was being heavily debated on Blogs and haydepark, it was described as a book with some of the greatest darkest secrets in Chassidic history. <BR/><BR/>I bought the book, read it and was pleasantly suprised.<BR/><BR/>What exactly is Asafs great discovery? A man who was mentally unstable, who doctors could not heal, converted, and because his father was the Alter Rebbe, it’s a challenge to the validity of Chassidus Chabad. <BR/><BR/>Even if what Asaf writes is true, the Gemorah writes about Tanoim who strayed from Torah, a Cohen Godal who became a Tzeduki. here we are talking about,1) a son 2) a troubled man, who suffered from Mental illness his whole life. <BR/><BR/>What’s so dirty about that? <BR/><BR/>In many places, like the story of the Chozah, the author brings a few different versions of the same story, the Chassidic versions and the “other” versions; the author then analyzes the story and draws his own conclusions. To me, the Sefer “Chassidim Umisnagdim” is a greater threat.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13084425.post-47090230072435793862008-01-03T15:34:00.000-05:002008-01-03T15:34:00.000-05:00GuravitzerI do vaguely remember a pnimi story abou...Guravitzer<BR/><BR/>I do vaguely remember a pnimi story about one of the Chassidim kottoning on a fresh kever of one of the misnagdishe gedolim (in the very early years of the machlyekes) and getting killed or almost did.<BR/>Where you referring to that?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13084425.post-20101691211312482092008-01-03T15:27:00.000-05:002008-01-03T15:27:00.000-05:00Mr. old friendsend me an e-mail and tell me who yo...Mr. old friend<BR/><BR/>send me an e-mail and tell me who you are. Please. <BR/>neveler at gmail dot comHirshel Tzig - הירשל ציגhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08911009966581004937noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13084425.post-2670512731773857902008-01-03T11:57:00.000-05:002008-01-03T11:57:00.000-05:00An inside joke.An inside joke.Guravitzerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09903833477421514457noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13084425.post-64051717633592735042008-01-03T11:19:00.000-05:002008-01-03T11:19:00.000-05:00Hershele, I think this time you overdid it. you do...Hershele, <BR/>I think this time you overdid it. you dont answer anything just personaly attack the author.<BR/><BR/>FACT, moshe was a meshumad no matter what the reason.<BR/><BR/>FACT, chabad tried to cover up.<BR/><BR/>so, in your (biased or unbiased) opinion, are these 2 facts true or false?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13084425.post-57287975653008257212008-01-03T10:58:00.000-05:002008-01-03T10:58:00.000-05:00maskilim had there sucsess stories in evrey camp,t...maskilim had there sucsess stories in evrey camp,those leaders of shtiblech yeshivas or lahvdil collegea attendees that did not convince their constituents not to read ONLY seforim from yirei hashem, became weak in their yiddishkeit if it did not show on the outside on them it surfaced on their childern ,moshe mendelsohn was a frummer yid ,the chasam soifer forbade touching his writings, one can hardly find things wrong in his writings (so the say)but the encouragement to his surroundings were to expose themselvs to the books of those who mock or criticize<BR/>the rabbis of various generations the rsults from this influence was disatoures from a yiddishkeit point of view,we (me Included)think we are smarter than those ehrliche yiden (regardles of how the were dressed or the nusech they davened)and expose our brain to negate ehriche yiden who in their whole life did not consume 1 percent of the Chitzonies that we Digest in one hour,and you Tzieg make a Chesbon Hanefesh you provide a platform for such a Pasloones ,one day you will any way stop (bloggers burn out)why not close it down today with a bang ,announce that you are going tomake a Sium on....by your next birthday and be M'svaddei B'robim on being a vehicle for propagating Ma Ahanei LON Rabonon and you are doing tesuva and closing the blog, l'chaimAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13084425.post-43608003895677164902008-01-03T09:30:00.001-05:002008-01-03T09:30:00.001-05:00I wouldn't want your dirty dollar.I wouldn't want your dirty dollar.Hirshel Tzig - הירשל ציגhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08911009966581004937noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13084425.post-1569658240438885402008-01-03T09:30:00.000-05:002008-01-03T09:30:00.000-05:00Guravitzer"He could have died like ?Shmuel Munkes?...Guravitzer<BR/><BR/>"He could have died like ?Shmuel Munkes? "<BR/><BR/>What was that story about?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13084425.post-26623136152691796662008-01-03T02:35:00.000-05:002008-01-03T02:35:00.000-05:00'' Far be it from me to engage in character assass...'' Far be it from me to engage in character assassination,''<BR/><BR/>Pal, you apparently hold of yourself quite highly.On the other hand I think that it's not at all far from you to engage in character assasination, in fact I would suspect much worse from you.<BR/>You, btw, mentioned this before with your post about Goldwasser, how 'uncharacteristic' it is of you to go down and dirty.Well, you've done it time and again.Bichlal reading your blog I get the impression that you are a serious mushchas bemiddos and a classic ingrate.<BR/>Actually, I have shown the blog to friends so they should see the side of Chabad that's hidden from most people.Resentful of others hatslocha i.e major infarginners,holding grudges through many generations, i.e bringing up two hundred year history which should long be buried and zilzul in anybody not of the chosen people.<BR/>You and that schnorer Berl area good fit, I would not trust you guys with a single dollarAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13084425.post-92201159305605643352008-01-02T23:45:00.000-05:002008-01-02T23:45:00.000-05:00דוד אסף עזב את הדת, הוא נולד דתי ולמד בבי"ס דתי אב...דוד אסף עזב את הדת, הוא נולד דתי ולמד בבי"ס דתי אבל אח"כ נהי' מדי פיקח...... ועזבAnonymousnoreply@blogger.com