A little blurb on COL today caught my eye. There was apparently a regional Kinus Hashluchim in Seattle recently, where Shluchim from the North/South/Southwest/Northwest attended. They met to discuss all kinds of issues affecting them and their communities, both with fellow Shluchim and with some of the leadership of the Chabad Shluchim institutions. One of the featured speakers at the weekend get together was Rabbi Moshe Klitnick, Rov of the ביקור חולים מחזיקי הדת shul in Seattle. Things like that warm the cackles of my heart, they tell me that we CAN all get along together, especially if we work towards a common goal. I realize that stories like these don't "do it" for us like a story of a full-blown war in Seattle would, but sometimes we do need to hear good news as well.
Don't get me wrong here, there's much to be done. The polarization process, blame it on whomever you wish, has taken hold in all sides here. The only difference is that those in control don't see it that way since it's all their group or Kreiz running the show. It's those that are not in control that feel the need to have everything of their own making and doing. In other words, a Satmarer doesn't feel like he's cut off from the rest of the world since there are so many of them, and they're "In charge" of Charedi Yiddishkeit, at least in the New York area. The fact that were it not for fear of reprisal he too would be marginalized is another matter. The same goes for the Yeshivishers. Now if only there were more of us, enough to write our own rules without worry, maybe then we'd be more respected. Until then let's all be friends and sing together....
About the Seattle Kinnus and Rabbi Kletenik's speech:
ReplyDeleteHis drosho was essentially about his connection to Lubavitch and the work of Lubavitch (the way he put it was, the Seattle Vaad has 8 Rabbonim - 3 shluchim, 4 Sfard, and me - the lone Ashkenaz Brisker Litvak!) beginning in Pittsburgh. His wife is the daughter of Rabbi Poupko of Pittsburgh, who was Rov in a Shul (I assume Shaarei Torah) when Rabbi Sholom Posner told him that he needed a place for the Cheder 60 years ago when it had just started, and Rabbi Poupko's reply was to bring them to the shul. When Rabbi Posner said, don't you have to ask the board? His reply was not to worry about the board.
The same thing happened with the son-in-law - when the school building was being redone, and Rabbi Kletenik was the Rov of his shver's shul, he was asked if his shul could host the school, and he answered as his father in law did.
This is all from his drosho.
In fact, the Rov of that shul in Pittsburgh is again not a Lubavitcher, but the assistant Rabbi is one of the local Shluchim.
u have it all wrong. rabbi Klitanick is modern orthedox. he is no yeshivisher that his black hat portrays. his wife speaks openly torah in shull and his hsull is very controversial with the local kolel guys.
ReplyDeleteput him into YU type rabbi and then u can see why he goes to chabad gathering.
looks very modern orthodox to me......
ReplyDeleteespecially the peyos behind the ear....
The fact that Kolel guys are "against him" tells me very little.
The Kollel in Seattle don't have a Minyan of support in the Seattle area - Reb Moshe Klitenik Vice President of the RCA is a very impresive Rov with lots of credit for working with all typs Sefrdim Ashkenazim and ... Chabad...
ReplyDeleteChabad in Seattle is the founders of the Seattle Vaad Harabonim. Chabad in Seattle is Torah and Yidishkayt in Seattle and the entire state of Washington - None counts the Local Collel.
And the Kolel did what they are so good in doing in Spliting the local Charedi Community, and bringing in lots of Sinaas Israel.
We only wish tham to go in the ways of Aish in Seattle whent
"Things like that warm the cackles of my heart"
ReplyDeleteSee here (http://idioms.thefreedictionary.com/warm+the+cockles+of+heart) and here (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/cockle) for the correct phrase.
That is the stupidest thing I have ever read. Since when is the definition of Yeshivish that the wife doesn't teach?! Since when is there a definition of Yeshivish period?
ReplyDeleteThis shul has been there for a long time, more than a century, I don't see why the opinion of a bunch of kollel guys that rolled into town recently has any meaning. It's been a frum shul since longer than Lakewood has had a frum community. Does that give any perspective?
well, what was the story of Aish in Seattle? do tell more!
ReplyDeleteI don't know Rabbi Klitnick, but I believe that Rabbi Poupko was one of the heads of Mizrachi
ReplyDeleteA little bit of web research turned up that the Tzig as usual, is talking out of his mechilah.
ReplyDeleteA)Firstly the correct spelling is Kletenik,
B)In the Wiki article about him he is not what you would call a Chareidi.He studied in The Hebrew Theological Seminary aka today as Skokie Yeshiva and then went to Yeshivas Brisk CHICAGO, which is the exact same path taken by the Tzigs 'enemy' Harry Maryles.He got Semicha from R'Ahron Soloveichik.
Yeshivas Brisk Chicago is not to be mixed up with the Brisker yeshivas in Eretz Yisroel, it was a Modern Orthodox yeshiva.
His father in law R'Baruch Poupko, who lives with them today was president of the Religous Zionists of America, not exactly 'yeshivish' don't you think?
His wife, Rebbitzen Rivy, has her own Wiki article and apparently is a very accomplished lecturer and speaker.She again appears to be a Modern Orthodox Rebbitzen.Check all this out on wikipedia.
I'm not making any judgement about the rabbi and his rebbitzen, I don't know them and feel sure that they are good people.What I am trying to say is that relying on this blog is very irresponsible.He uses this as an example of the yeshiva world becoming closer to Lubavitch, when all it is about is that the Modern Orthodox have had a relationship with Chabad.We knew that.
wow
ReplyDeletetranslating his name from Hebrew spelling to the assumed English makes me one "who talks out of my Mechilleh?" I guess in your warped book it does.
I also see that you insist on finding any way possible to fan the flames of divisiveness amongst Jews the world over. The fact that he learned in Skokie, the Yeshivah where the Rosh Agudas Yisroel taught tells me what exactly? More than the fact that a guy who could've grown to be a MO Rabbi with a knitted Yarmulke is instead a black hatter? and in Seattle of all places?
I said nothing about him being a Brisker, that was brought up by a commenter here, you'd see that if you paid attention. but you were too busy watching my mechilleh.
according to my memory I was told here Chabad was hostile to all groups, whether MO, or Yeshivish, so that debunks part of your theory part of the time. We can debate his level of frumkeit later.
ReplyDelete'That debunks part of my theory'
ReplyDeleteTalking from your M again?
What theory?Did I say anything about that?
You were trying to bring out an achdus with the yeshiva world.That would be a great thing if it could be accomplished (but then, what would you write about in your blog??)The Modern Orthodox have had a relationship with Lubavitch before and this would not be unusual.Y.University has a Tanya club.
Do very basic research before you post or we''ll have more posts from you ala Shturems celebrating the great Chabdsker Shlomo Zalman Shechter
I think the lesson in all of this is a warning to all normal Jewish leaders out there: Beware of peaceful association with Lubavitch, your compatriots will hate you together with them.
ReplyDeleteyou is a collective noun here. Try and think for a minute. and wipe the foam from your mouth, it ruins computers.
ReplyDeleteThe ahavas yisroel team is at it again.Heshy and the indefatigable hmmm.Bravo.
ReplyDeleteThat's right, anonymous 3:39, blame the victim. Bravo to you too.
ReplyDeleteHey, it's the American thing to do. We're not supposed to open our mouths and squeak.
ReplyDeleteAccording to his Wiki article he's the head of the Seattle Hebrew Academy, which is affiliated with Torah UMesorah. Does that not count as Yeshivish?
ReplyDeleteTzig
ReplyDeleteTorah Umesorah encompasses many day schools of many Orthodox stripes and he is not the founder.
The point again was that you saw signs of 'achdus' with his guest speaker status, unfortunately that is not what it was about.
Does anybody here know to what sort of yeshivas his kids or sons-in-law went?
Yes, I realize he's not the founder, since it was founded 10 years before he was born, but I would imagine that the principals would meet their requirements, even if the students may come from all different backgrounds.
ReplyDeleteThe point is that a black hatter with a beard and peyos in Seattle is probably a Yeshivisher. There seems to be no other explanation, no matter what his wife looks like or who his shver was, or where he went to Yeshivah.
Seriously speaking Tzig, the level of humor of the arguments presented against you is getting funnier and funnier.
ReplyDeleteWhere did you see peyos?
ReplyDeleteRabbi Aharon Soloveichik was a black hatter with peyos btw, but was in Harry Maryles' group.Rabbi Kleteniks father in law , head of Mizrachi in America for a long time , I think, wears a black hat.
Many moden orthodox rabbis from Y.U wear black hats.
'the level of humor of the arguments presented against you is getting funnier and funnier'
ReplyDeleteHmmm, I did not know you knew Greek.
It is interesting to see how quickly the conversation devolves into the sort of divisive name calling the article was meant to combat. Rabbi Moshe Kletenik is not the head of the Seattle Hebrew Academy - his wife Rivy Poupko Kletenik is - whoever felt that from reading a Wikipedia article should review their reading comprehension skills. The question was asked as to where his children go to yeshiva. His older son attended Yehshivat Hakotel and YU - his younger son attended Ner Israel and is presentlty studying in Brisker Kollel in Jerusalem. Rabbi Kletenik's older daughter attended Michlala Yerushalayim and now teaches at a Bais Yaakov in Queens while his younger daughter attended Migdal Oz and is presently in Stern College for Women. - I wonder if this knowledge helps or obfiscates - maybe it will help break your narrow and somewhat random definitions.
ReplyDelete