a.k.a. Rabbi Freifeld's Rebbe, those of you who read Yisroel Besser's classic know about Rav Telushkin and how he and his shul in East New York Gubernye influenced young Shlomo.
and yes, er hut gehalten fun Rebben.... I say that because I know somebody will bring that up, so I head him off at the pass.
he quotes the rebbe in his seforim as a chosid, now lets see how the Kat HaChabad Bashers, will start twisting, as they all tried very hard on RJBS letter
ReplyDeleteThe guy doesn't write all the details. He also learned by the holy Rebbe of Babroisk, Reb Shmaria Noach ZIA, in the "Kibbutz", he and harav Zevin ZTL were Babrioska Chasidim and talmidim. (In this article he is presented as just a Litvisher Rav),
ReplyDeleteHe was also Rav in Dukar for many years. His sforim al Hatorah are beautiful drush laced with Chasidic spirit.
Did he quote the Rebbe in his sefer on mikvoas?
ReplyDeleteSome of his divrei torah were published by R'Grainom Lazevnik shlit"a, a Novardoker talmid with a shul in Flatbush who was a partisan in the War.
ReplyDeleteHamodia had an article about him.
N.B
Grainom is not a very common name to say the least.Besides for the famous Lubavitcher chused by that name I don't know of anyone else.
R'Grainom is not of Lubavitch stock, but actually taught at the Lubavitcher yeshiva on Ocean Pkwy for many years
Fluke
ReplyDeleteYes.
and what would happen if he didn"t?
Anon
ReplyDelete"He was also Rav in Dukar for many years"
I think that R Yochanan Gordon was from Dukar
how many "hakhels" did your guy have in 50 years?
ReplyDelete"R'Grainom is not of Lubavitch stock, but actually taught at the Lubavitcher yeshiva on Ocean Pkwy for many years"
ReplyDeleteand prior to that he taught Ivrit at Bedford and Dean for many years.
"I think that R Yochanan Gordon was from Duka"
ReplyDeleteNo!Dukshitz, unless their the same.
son?
ReplyDeletehttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_Telushkin
Joseph Telushkin (born 1948) is an American Modern Orthodox rabbi, lecturer, and author.
Telushkin attended the Yeshivah of Flatbush, was ordained at Yeshiva University, and studied Jewish history at Columbia University.
Telushkin serves as a rabbi for the Los Angeles-based Synagogue for the Performing Arts founded in 1972 by Rabbi Jerome Cutler.
He is an associate of the National Jewish Center for Learning and Leadership. He is a former director of education at the Brandeis-Bardin Institute. Telushkin is also a Senior Associate with CLAL (The National Jewish Center for Learning and Leadership), and is a member of the board of directors of the Jewish Book Council. He was a major force behind 1996 Senate Resolution 151, establishing a "National Speak No Evil Day" in the United States.
Telushkin's book, Jewish Literacy: The Most Important Things to Know About the Jewish Religion, Its People and Its History, is one of the best-selling books on Judaism of the past two decades.[citation needed] The first volume of A Code of Jewish Ethics, entitled A Code of Jewish Ethics: You Shall be Holy, which Telushkin regards as his major life's work, was published in 2006. The second volume, entitled, A Code of Jewish Ethics: Love Your Neighbor, was released in 2009.
Telushkin tours the United States as a lecturer on Jewish topics.
One Erev Yom Kippur Rav Telushkin upon arriving at the Mikvah on Pennsylvania Ave. in Brownsville which had two mikvois , one of which had been used extensively that day and had the consistency of pea soup, was told by the Mikvah attendent "Rav Telushkin far eich hob ich rezovirt der raine Mikveh.Yene Mikveh hobin asach genutzt".At which point Rav Telushkin spat on the floor and said "fuy!Ich gay vi alle Yidden gayin".
ReplyDeleteJJJ
ReplyDeleteJoseph Telushkin is a grandson
the late great Montrealer Rosh Yeshiva Reb Mottel Weinberg said the following.
ReplyDeleteeach Shabbos afternoon he would visit brookdale (I think) medical center, a hospital on near Brownsville (i think it became Beth Israel.)
the seventh floor was the death floor with all the terminally ill patients, l'a.
one week the nurse says to him do you know this Rabbi, hes an angel? and she shows him Rabbi Telushkin, who was a patient at the time."'why is he an angel?" asked R' Mottel. she said that since he was admitted, six week earlier , not one person on the floor had died, the by far longest period in the hospital's history, and no one did until he was released.
It should be noted;
ReplyDeleteI heard a number of years ago from a big תלמיד חכם who spoke to him about his having gone to פארבריינגענס, that it was ניקר על פניו his אומצופרידענקייט at participating in these events. He had חשבונות why he attended, but it definitely was not because "er hut gehalten fun Rebben...." I don't know if you will post this, but it's something you should know about in any case.
Brookdale is still there under the same name.
ReplyDelete"I heard a number of years ago from a big תלמיד חכם who spoke to him about his having gone to פארבריינגענס, that it was ניקר על פניו his אומצופרידענקייט at participating in these events"
ReplyDeleteBeing a big or small תלמיד חכם does not make one an expert on palm reading nor face reading.I know with a certainty from reliable sources,not "face readers", that the above assessment is completely fallacious.I wonder, what school of thought does this תלמיד חכם subscribes to?
Anon3:
ReplyDeleteMaybe you should understand that sometimes it takes one תלמיד חכם to understand the feelings of another. Rav Telushkin was a person who's level of learning was light-years ahead of Rabbi Schneurson. He did not care for the latter's antics and he certainly did not need to come on to him by any stretch of the imagination.
The Talmud Chochum heard it from him or is he a specialist in reading body language the way the TC wants? And besides, how can we verify that indeed such a TC exists, and that you met him and he is by any stretch of the imagination actually a TC to decide anything, and how do we certify that you are enough of a TC to assess if the one you quote from, is a TC? At least by reading your words, its not ניקר that you are a TC, maybe a מנקר.
ReplyDeleteBut if the body reader, supposed TC, would indeed have an iota of wisdom to merit that honorific, and even more so to claim to understand the facial expressions of Rabbi Telushkin, he would at least - that's just basic - have read his seforim and would have known that he brings and qoutes the Rebbe ZTL with utmost respect, so now you would claim that that is also ניקר that its was Chesbonos...
(And how do you really know, that he was greater scholar than the Rebbe? And what makes you think that if some one comes to a Chasidic Rebbe he come because the Rebbe is a bigger scholar than him?)
insanity run amok!
"He did not care for the latter's antics and he certainly did not need to come on to him by any stretch of the imagination."
ReplyDelete"Rav Telushkin was a person who's level of learning was light-years ahead of Rabbi Schneurson.So let me understand this."
Apparently your knowledge of "Rabbi Schneurson" is so great that you can't even his spell his name correctly.
So let me get this straight."he certainly did not need to come on to him by any stretch of the imagination." and yet he attended almost every major farbregen of ""Rabbi Schneurson" from beginning to end, and I did not hear this from any "תלמיד חכם".I witnessed it with my own eyes.And why did he attend?Because some ignorant "Lubab" was blackmailing him for money laundering? How many people can attest to the fact "that it was it was ניקר על פניו his אומצופרידענקייט" apart from this "great תלמיד חכם"? Are you saying that he was the only תלמיד חכם that attended The Rebbes farbrengens?How many did he attend that he was such an"expert" on the facial expressions of RT?
I do not deign to say who was "light years"ahead of who in lomdus yet you who title yourself "מלבשתו ענווה" has the audacity to make that judgement?Are YOU the "תלמיד חכם" in question? Can you give us your source for your "inside information" for this astounding revelation and knowledge that you profess to have? "ענווה? My foot!!!!
My apologies for the poor grammar and incorrect punctuation in my last post.I was just overwhelmed by the "anivus" of "מלבשתו ענווה" and did not bother to proof read before posting.
ReplyDeleteAnon3:
ReplyDeleteQuit "fomenting at the mouth" and listen- maybe you will actually learn something! How many people do you know that have discussed with him his attendance at the פארבריינגענס? This person that spoke to him was not one to frequent פארבריינגענס himself he just discussed it with Rav Telushkin Z"L. For your information, ניקר על פניו is a way of describing how he gave over a subtle message without having to spell it out. I don't know why you have resort to crazy ideas like "some ignorant "Lubab" was blackmailing him for money laundering", he could have had a thousand and one different reasons for having participated and none of them were because "er hut gehalten fun Rebben..."
By the way, you want to know which school of thought this תלמיד חכם subscribes to. The answer is: to the school of thought that allows one to develop thoughts on his own without the help of brainwash and propaganda.
"Quit "fomenting at the mouth" and listen- maybe you will actually learn something! How many people do you know that have discussed with him his attendance at the פארבריינגענס? This person that spoke to him was not one to frequent פארבריינגענס himself he just discussed it with Rav Telushkin Z"L".
ReplyDeleteI am "trying to "learn something" here.First you tell us that that all this was" ניקר על פניו" of RT his "אומצופרידענקייט".Now you change your story and tell that he was actually told this "revelation" by RT.So when was it all ניקר על" פניו", at the farbrengin that this individual allegedly attended or in a supposed conversation he had with RT?Are you trying to get us all to believe that a man of RT's stature actually bad mouthed the Rebbe to this "privileged" individual?Aren't you stretching your creditability somewhat thinly?
And then we get to the gist of the matter
"By the way, you want to know which school of thought this תלמיד חכם subscribes to. The answer is: to the school of thought that allows one to develop thoughts on his own without the help of brainwash and propaganda".Doh ligt der hunt bagroben.This "by the way" reveals your true agenda.Your'e just another "hater" of the Rebbe and all us "brainwashed" Lubavitchers who have succumbed to the all powerful Chabad "propaganda" apparatus.
Hirshel
Did you actually think that you have jerks like this "Headed off at the pass"?Apparently at least one idiot did get through.
I heard from a "Big talmid Chochom" reminds me of one of my pet Yeshivishe beefs.
ReplyDeleteWhen someone says "I heard from R' Malkiels driver" , it's like saying Halocho L'Moshe M'Sinai.
Someone was attendance for many years, seemingly there's no evidence of someone standing behind him with a gun to his back, comes a Yeshiva mann and says "No,he was there against his will."
Is this logic the way you learn a blatt Gemara, or did your Gemara logic guide you to think this way?
R. Telushkin was nifter in'70, so his presence at 770 can not be construed as approval for anything happening afterwards in 770.So please keep things in perspective.
ReplyDeleteAnon3:
ReplyDeleteAside from trying to twist my words, you are also making a mountain out of a molehill. I never said that R' Telushkin badmouthed anybody ח''ו. If you can't understand what I was saying, I will try to spell it out for you a little clearer. All I am saying over is, that R' Telushkin indicated without saying straight out, that he attended for reasons other than ווייל ער האט געהאלטען פון רבי'ן because ער האט נישט צופיל געהאלטען פון עם. I don't understand why you seem to think I changed my story.
As far as your keen detective skills in finding וואו דער הונט ליגט באגראבט, I am sorry to disappoint you. I don't hate anybody, and I certainly don't think חב''ד has a monopoly on the power of brainwashing and propaganda.The "R' Malkiel's driver = הל''מ" (to quote the commentator before me) mentality is just as much under the influence of brainwash and propaganda as "the world starts and stops with R' Schneerson" mentality (if that makes you feel any better).
In a perfect world I would have no problem mentioning the name of my source, but given the types of people lurking out there, unfortunately it would not be the right thing to do.
מלבשתו ענווה
ReplyDeleteLet me put this in simpler words.You come onto this blog site and tell us the story of some anonymous, unnamed individual having a discussion with RT and recognized by facial expressions the umtzufridenkeit or whatever you want to call it of RT with attending these farbrengings.Then you state that he could have had a "thousand reasons" other then wanting to be there,for his attendance.I assume yourself to be a"ben Taireh" and a "bar das" yet you use the flimsiest of svorehs to substantiate this "gevaldege chiddush" that no one except you and and this unnamed TC are aware of.As a "Gemoreh kup",which you seem to think you are, you build quite a shaky foundation for your boich svoreh.A "thousand reasons"?I'll settle for two or even one.Please enlighten us.
Then you go on to state " He did not care for the latter's (LR's) antics".Was this premise stated by RT,the unnamed TC or is it your own personal projection?Then you come flying in from left field with the following accusation that we believe that "the world starts and stops with R' Schneerson" which is completely out of context and has no relativity with this "dialog" (well at least you got the spelling right this time).Then we have this "light years ahead" business.Again whose observation is this,RT's,the TC's or your own assumption.What do you base it on?Have you made a "scientific" study of the LR's and RT's lomdus to state it with such certainty?And who is really "brain washed"?
PS"In a perfect world I would have no problem mentioning the name of my source, but given the types of people lurking out there, unfortunately it would not be the right thing to do"
ReplyDeleteHow convenient.
You're taking this to personal!
ReplyDeleteAll I have to tell you is that if you had the guts to ask by someone who knew R' Telushin WELL (that was נהנה from him in תורה), you will see that I am the מוחזק and you are the מוציא.
As far as me being a בן תורה, a more accurate description would probably be שנה ופירש. A בן תורה does not have enough time on his hands to fool around in the blogosphere.
"You're taking this to personal!"
ReplyDeleteYou bet I am.
"All I have to tell you is that if you had the guts to ask by someone who knew R' Telushin WELL (that was נהנה from him in תורה), you will see that I am the מוחזק and you are the מוציא."
I was/am related to a well known Rosh Yeshiva Z'L of a Non Lubavitch Mesivta who was a close yedid of RT and what I heard from him paints an entirely different picture then you portray about his relationship with the LR.So I to am a מוחזק maybe more so.I have never heard from ANY source reliable or not anything that remotely resembles your "definitive proof" as stated by one solitary, anonymous individual and challenge you to back your claim by something more substantiative then the above kool aid (as some posters here use this term)inspired depiction of the relationship between the LR and RT.Should I hold my breath?
The reason this Umtzufriedenkeit is hard to take seriously is that as someone pointed out, RT attended before '70, so it was before Chabad operators adopted the media-seeking "See everybody loves us" approach that might have used some friendly or unfriendly encouragement to "make" him attend. So a PR motive is absent in that era. Any other blackmail-type taam is far-fetched. So the claimant is clearly the motzie and not the muchzak. Forget "beyond shadow of a doubt". There's no "there" there.
ReplyDeleteIt's certainly no stretch to accept that there were RY's and rabbonim who disliked Chabad. I know and knew a number of them myself. If R' Telushkin happens to be one them, I will sleep soundly. But to claim mysteriously that a rabbinic frequent attendee of farbrengens was among them is "vait", to say the least, regardless of your source, and ignoring the usual canard that you're anonymous, which is pointless as we all are.
I am enjoying seeing a bunch of Hungarians and Galitzianer writing about Chabad history .
ReplyDeleteThe last Bobroisker . How do you know ? have you investigated this. Did you know that at least 3 of his Rabbi SN Schneersohn's grandsons were alive at this time and knew Chassisus well. Their were other famous talmidim of Babroisk like rav Abraham Chaim Lubanov of Leningrad and rav SY Zevin.
I met a old shochet in a BP nursing home from Baltimore who considered himself a Bobroisker long after 1970. And finally what's a Bobroisker as the Bobroisker rebbe was the last nasi of Kopust.
Greynem , of course you never heard of the name , it was not common in Pishpik Lodony,but in Lita and White Russia it was not an uncommon name - try these on for size Lapidoth (a first name) Shepsel, and many more.
Were there any Amraaams in Vilna ? Hishkashrus whats s the debate about , most every gadol world wide was mekushar and kafuf to the nasi hador !
Reb "Anonymous," ahem
ReplyDeletethanks for being so "medayek" in my words, but it wasn't called for. This isn't a shtikkel Tanya, after all. What I meant was that I believed him to be the last TALMID of רש"נ in America. There was רשי"ז in ארה"ק, but not in the US
Correct me if I was wrong
First the yiddishistn,then the old Litvishe,then the Babroisker and soon the Lubavitchers. Let's face it ,you can't remain frum in this great and wild country unless you build 10 foot thick walls around you ,like satu-mare and Skver.A fact of life.
ReplyDeleteKotter, What ekse did you see in 770 a patchuk or two maybe ?
ReplyDeleteDu frekst noch "maybe?"
ReplyDeleteAnon3
ReplyDeleteFor someone who so dislike anonymous sources, it is interesting that you have no problem quoting one yourself.
Be well
Musikant
ReplyDelete"and knew Chassisus well."
can you proof for us that you really found a Alte Babroasker that hot gut farshtanen chasidus. Did you hear him quote a piece of Likutie Torah, and you made your decision.
please share it with us, Ungaarishe, Galicianer Tipshim.
מלבשתו ענווה
ReplyDeletedo you think that he did not like the Rebbes Lomdus? Is his sefer on Mikvoas "the sefer" that the Rebbe would not be capable of writing? or the Rebbes rightwing hashkofas regarding Israel? don't forget he was a Mizrachi Ruv. So maybe the Rebbe was too left wing?
Ask that talmid chochem (Face Reader) why does he quote the Rebbe in his seforim with high respect.?
Malbashtoi,
ReplyDeleteניקר על פניו
first find the talmid chochem to teach you ivri,
your Niker you do for achorien of a cow.
You are mamash like the Lubabs, before you learned Ivri they teached you to hate the Rebbe
ויכר ויאמר צדקת ממני
ReplyDeleteYou are right. I misspelled and I am sorry. It still does not mitigate or detract in any way from the truth of what I am saying.
Please cut some slack for a שנה ופירש. Reading החרש היה לבם instead of החדש הזה לכם was a bigger spelling blunder.
I also want to clarify for whoever cares: I do not (and I never did) hate your Rebbe ע''ה. I don't know why you are accusing me as such.
ReplyDelete"Is his sefer on Mikvoas "the sefer" that the Rebbe would not be capable of writing?"
ReplyDeleteHow do you know that the Rebbe is capable of writing such a sefer?
"For someone who so dislike anonymous sources, it is interesting that you have no problem quoting one yourself."
ReplyDeleteIs this the only thing you can come up with in response to the many questions asked of you by myself and others regarding your profound boich svoreh?
Anony8:12. A group of highly regarded Hassidei habad migdolei habeetees hobn zei farhert un gezogt peh echod az zei hobn understooded chasiduth very well.A bavuste mayseh.
ReplyDeleteAnonymous > Read my comments . Perhaps I should write in Hungarian. I said the Bobroisker's eyniklech knew DACH. One Reb Eli Schneersohn used to come to kfar chabad to chazer dach. I heard this from chassiidm of the nasi hador in 1969 who reported on their visit to israel that year.Another eynikle rav Israel Moshe Barbash of Tel Aviv was a Lelever chasid ( and was said by the old lelever rebbe to be raui to lead an eda kedosha).Also if you can read lashon kodesh read the Holy Will of the Babroisker rebbe to be found in the Bobroisk memorial volume, and you will note he suggests any of these 3 eyniklech to lead the eda of kopust Bobroisk. Now I doubt you will accuse Reb Shmarye Noach of leaving his eda in the hands of ketanim .(or as you nicely put it tipshim... your lashon not mine by the way...)
ReplyDeleteAre you woried that we will find an eynikle of Kopust and start a Kopust Chabad BM in Israel, Has Aguch copyrighted Kopust and obroisk good idea call Nat ASAP !
Anovoh: Nem zich nit tzum hartzen. Sometimes this neighborhood gets a little rough.At least the Kotter in 770 believes you.
ReplyDeleteUchony Kotter ,
ReplyDeleteIs your chalav Israel at 212 or do you also drink J&J or even the regular stuff. as per rav Moshe's opinion did you see the new sefer about him ? Did you ever try medium cream meow !
Imre Igor...
ReplyDeleteEven in Budapest you would be the biggest Tipesh...
Anony. 7:43 Read your history. Budapest was filled with Jewish doctors,lawyers,bankers,and gelerente.The tipshim were in "other"areas.Ask someone who was there.And the tipshim of old wanted to get a good education unlike today's
ReplyDeletetipshim.
I am not in the habit of commenting on blogs, however seeing the SPECULATION about rabbi telushkin's kesher with the rebbe, I feel the need to clarify for rabbi telushkin's sake. that r' moshe aharon geisinsky,who was the shamash in rabbi telushkin's shul for many years, told me several stories about rabbi telushkins bittul to the rebbe even though he wasn't a chossid per se. (p.s. he was also a bochen in tomchei temimim bedford and deen)
ReplyDeleteI distinctly remember a narrative told by my father,R. Moshe Ahron Geisinsky who was extremely careful in the veracity of his words.
ReplyDeleteHe related that he was once at the home of RNT when the phone rang. After picking up the receiver RNT immediately jumped up from his chair and said "yeh Rebbe".The caller was none other than the Rebbe and he was calling to ask RNT to assist in a matter concerning the welfare of a Yid!!!
This narrative should clear up about the esteem RNT held for the Rebbe.
Maasa Shehoyo
Elchanan Geisinsky