You may remember R' M. Gifter once attacked the Lubavitcher Rebbe saying: "While others were sitting and learning, he was sitting in college" (Although, um, somebody should have reminded R' Gifter that he himself went to college...) But to paraphrase a quote by R' J.B.S.: Although many of the future leaders of Klal Yisroel went to college in those years, the Lubavitcher Rebbe reamained a Chassidishe Jew - while many others had much to be embrassed about from those college years.
I guess RMG suffered from the same thing others of his generation in America suffered from: namely "trying-to-forget-where-they-came-from disease" a.k.a. "trying-to-sound-zealous-disease"
That link was from google video, this is the "official" version. This one is much shorter, but it does have one extra interview, that with David Fakler
You crack me up. You'll buy any pro-chabad propaganda, no matter who it comes from - but if the same guys had been critical you'd be killing them all today.
anonymous maybe it's time you rethought all the lies you've been taught all these years by your Roshei Yeshiva and newspapers, maybe they spoke of hate at worst and lack of knowledge at best?!
Ok Tzigalleh, we got your drift. The Rebbe was Gd's gift to mankind and any/everybody else is worthless. But hey, you made this point months ago...............aren't you bored of repeating this crud? In the meantime back at the ranch.....in 770, bais rabbeinu, your meshugoim are getting worse and worse.They are posting on the internet pictures of the Rebbe giving out dollarls, kais shel brocha etc this TiShrei!! So a little multiple quiz... Who is to blame for the Meshichiten,Elokisten and sh'ar marin bishin in todays Lubavitch.(the names are kderech Chabad without honorifics, since honorifics belong only to the Rebbeim) 1)Hutner,Isaac
2)Kotler,AAron 3)Shach 4)Gifter 5)Finkel,aka Alter fun Slabodka............OR...
I cannot imagine what would compel people to assume, imagine, and just plain make up stories about the Rebbe about his days in Paris and Berlin. To them any proof is "propaganda" and spin, because they think otherwise.
Avremel, not bad,(Small correction, it's r'YEHOSUA Leib Diskin) But you missed the point, In that generation/s many left Judaism from ALL krayzen . Todays Lubavitcher meshugoim/apikorsim clame the Rebbe as their inspiration.
'In 1909, Rabbi Levi Yitzchak, Rebbetzin Chana and their three 'sons moved to Dnepropetrovsk, a huge military city 520 kilometers from Kiev, where Rabbi Levi Yitzchok became the rabbi of the city’s 25 synagogues and 50,000 Jews. He turned to Rabbi Zalman Vilenkin, asking him to teach his sons. Chana Shapiro is Rabbi Vilenkin’s daughter, recalling her parents’ descriptions of the children in their home.' Taken from the site Tzigaleh linked. Classic Chabasker revisionism R'Levik was A Rov in Dnepropetrovsk not THE rov and the city was not a frum place at all, very shvach actually, not a rabbonus to be proud about
HaGaon Reb. Yehoshua Leib Diskin was born in Horodno, where his father Reb Binyomin was rov and rosh yeshiva.
Although Reb Binyomin was extremely busy with communal matters and the yeshiva, he preferred to teach his son Torah himself rather than send him to a private melamed as everyone else did. Thus he taught him personally from a tender age until he was a grown man.
It is told that one year on Kol Nidrei night HaRav Binyomin was late for shul. The men sent to investigate found him learning with his son.
The father apologized saying he had made an account of his deeds of the past year and had not found any worthy deeds to present as merits on the Yom Hadin and he therefore quickly wanted to fulfill the mitzva of veshinantom levonecho.
Reb Yehoshua Leib was engaged before his bar mitzva and at the age of fourteen he married the daughter of HaRav Brode and lived with his father-in-law in Wolkowitz.
He became rov in various cities such as Lomza, Mezritch, Kovno, Shklov, and finally in Brisk from where his fame spread and whose name is associated with him until today: old Yerushalmim stand up as they mention his name in awe-- the Brisker Rov.
He was imprisoned following a libel against him and after being freed on Yom Kippur 5637 (1876) he decided that Succos to leave Russia for Paris and then on to Eretz Yisroel.
When he arrived there he refused to accept an official rabbinical post, but nonetheless in practice he led the city and all its affairs: the talmidim, kollelim, his famous battle against the Maskilim and against those who wanted to work in the fields during shmittah.
He was the first rabbi to protest the unfounded heteirim and he encouraged shmittah observance in Eretz Yisroel.
On motzei Shabbos Erev Rosh Chodesh Shevat 5658 (1898) he left this world and was buried the next morning on Har Hazeisim opposite the Har Habayis. Zechuso yogen oleinu!
Yuntev there's no cake to be had here. Shulchan Aruch is not a sefer emunah, therefore, an apikores can rightfully claim that he listens to the shulchan aruch only.
Hershel why are you such a shallow partisan?Munkatsh was a frum city with hundreds of budding talmidei chachomim in the Michas Eluzers famous yeshiva,same for Satu Mare,Dnepropetrovsk,was way off the Jewish map,and yes, R'Levik was NOT the chief rabbi, he shared the rabbonus with another two rabbonim
How can anyone attack Reb Levik. Who cares if he was "chief rabbi' or not. He was a great rav and a greater Jew. By the late 1920's he was the shdot rav. Dnepropetrovk was a large city with thousands of Jews many frum and many Chabad people. Was Rabbi Yakov Yosef really chief rabbi of NY ? If you think everyone in Bergszas, Munkatch,, Chust , Ungevar and yes Sighet was frum , you would be interested in purchasing 770 from me too. Reb Levik iz geven der zelber gadol vi di andere Litvishe rabbonim und efsher mit a shmitzik gresser. Veho rayya in the 1930' all of Moscow Jews accepted hm as their Rav . Aval Lo Istaya Milso. a gutten erev Shabbes
Nobody attacked R'Levik. Perspective was the focus.He was NOT chief rabbi of Dnepropetrovsk, the said city was of zero significance on the Jewish map and rov of Moscow in the mid thirties is very little claim to fame after most people could not observe shabbos and almost all scholars had long fled. Historical perspective friends. Btw how in heaven was R'Yaakov Yosef dragged into this??HE was revered DESPITE being Rov in NEW YORK, not because of it
Oh, ok, any non Chabadsker is rov mita'am? I guess that's why you needed four chief rabbis in Kiev. Interesting to note VERY COMMON that chabadsker self appoint or 'just decide' that their crony is chief rabbi, for example in a certain city in Italy, the local chabadsker 'paskens' on himself that he is chief rabbi, though all he really is is rov of a shul, same for the 'chief rabbi' of the former ussr.Rabbonim mitaam atsmom.Vekaheino, rabois
I see you really must be suffering from ADD, because you cannot keep to one subject for longer than 3o seconds. Please try and remember what the topic of this post was and comment regarding it. Also, if you're asked a question try and answer it if you can.
My post regarding Lubabs penchant to 'grab' rabbinical positions, was quite clear.Don't mix up posts that you don't like with incoherent ones. If you really want to 'akshen ayn' we shall grant you that R'Levik was chief rabbi of Dnepopetrovsk a city uknown and unremembered that left zero mark on the Jewish world. Does that historical revisionism make you happy??
In Russia many towns had 2 rabbonim , 1 for Chassidim and 1 for the Olam or eilemas I would say. In Dnepropetrovsk Rav Levik was basically the Chabad rav (that is chosen by Chabad people)and I think its rabbi Berman or a name I can not recall who was the eilem rav. But both were the shdot rav.Their activities and responsibliltiy impacted on the whole Jewish community. Reb levik participated in amny rabbinic conferences before and after the Revolution.He was clearly among the gedole hoRabbonim of Czarist Russia, In Dvinsk botht the Chabad rav the Rogochover and the eilem rav Or Samaech were the shdot rav and the same was true everywhere. Who said rav Levik was not the shdot rav in Dnep.?
I said he was ONE of the rabbonim in the city and was addressing the common chabadsker penchant to 'grab' positions .In the link that tzig provided regarding the videos about the rebbe, one headline mentioned that R'Levik was THE ROV OF Dnepopetrovsk, I pointed out that he was not THE rov, rather a rov,that Dnepo, was a freiyer city with very little claim to fame. Regarding Dvinsk:The Rogatchover was NOT the Chabad rov, he was rov of the chassidim, though there were no real chassidim in the classical sense, they just davened another nusach. Btw, much hay has been made by Chabad regarding the Rogatchovers shayches to Chabad.It has very little basis in truth.I would love to hear from anyone here if any of the Chabad rebbe is quoted by him in tsofnas pa'anech or anywhere else.True they would be in good company, since one of the only achroinim he quotes is the Chacham Tzvi.It is also obvious that because of a massive yeridas hadoiros, he had very little in common with Lubavitchs' leadership(I dare say that he was not fond of Harry Potter style works). Apparently his father had some shaychus to Kopust, that'S how the Chabad 'grabbed' him.Typical
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You may remember R' M. Gifter once attacked the Lubavitcher Rebbe saying:
ReplyDelete"While others were sitting and learning, he was sitting in college"
(Although, um, somebody should have reminded R' Gifter that he himself went to college...)
But to paraphrase a quote by R' J.B.S.:
Although many of the future leaders of Klal Yisroel went to college in those years, the Lubavitcher Rebbe reamained a Chassidishe Jew - while many others had much to be embrassed about from those college years.
I guess RMG suffered from the same thing others of his generation in America suffered from: namely "trying-to-forget-where-they-came-from disease" a.k.a. "trying-to-sound-zealous-disease"
ReplyDeletethat's the minhog ho'olam, you attack others for no reason for things that you're guilty of....
ReplyDeleteIs this the same as the link you posted earlier that was taken down?
ReplyDeleteThat link was from google video, this is the "official" version. This one is much shorter, but it does have one extra interview, that with David Fakler
ReplyDeleteYou crack me up.
ReplyDeleteYou'll buy any pro-chabad propaganda, no matter who it comes from - but if the same guys had been critical you'd be killing them all today.
so you think this 95 year old guy is part of the big propaganda machine?
ReplyDeleteNo - BUT I do think that you'd be killing him today as a "Lubavitch Hater" if he had said critical things.
ReplyDeleteif shmif
ReplyDeleteanonymous
ReplyDeletemaybe it's time you rethought all the lies you've been taught all these years by your Roshei Yeshiva and newspapers, maybe they spoke of hate at worst and lack of knowledge at best?!
Ok Tzigalleh, we got your drift.
ReplyDeleteThe Rebbe was Gd's gift to mankind and any/everybody else is worthless.
But hey, you made this point months ago...............aren't you bored of repeating this crud?
In the meantime back at the ranch.....in 770, bais rabbeinu, your meshugoim are getting worse and worse.They are posting on the internet pictures of the Rebbe giving out dollarls, kais shel brocha etc this TiShrei!!
So a little multiple quiz...
Who is to blame for the Meshichiten,Elokisten and sh'ar marin bishin in todays Lubavitch.(the names are kderech Chabad without honorifics, since honorifics belong only to the Rebbeim)
1)Hutner,Isaac
2)Kotler,AAron
3)Shach
4)Gifter
5)Finkel,aka Alter fun Slabodka............OR...
7)Rabbi M.M SCHNEERSON
Yuntev
ReplyDeleteto blame? hmmm
I'd say G-d
he runs the world
are we to blame Gedolei Yisroel like:
ReplyDelete1) Reb Yitzchok Elchonon
2) Reb Shua Leib
3) The Bais HaLevi
4) Reb Yisroel Salanter
5) Reb Chaim Brisker
6) The Aderes
7) The Netziv
8) Reb Dovid Karliner
for the mass exodus from Judaism of their adherents, students, townspeople?
you get my point....
(not bad knowledge of Litvishe for a "Chabadsker", eh?
WE'RE GETTING OFF TRACK, AGAIN
ReplyDeleteI cannot imagine what would compel people to assume, imagine, and just plain make up stories about the Rebbe about his days in Paris and Berlin. To them any proof is "propaganda" and spin, because they think otherwise.
Avremel, not bad,(Small correction, it's r'YEHOSUA Leib Diskin)
ReplyDeleteBut you missed the point, In that generation/s many left Judaism from ALL krayzen .
Todays Lubavitcher meshugoim/apikorsim clame the Rebbe as their inspiration.
claim*
ReplyDeleteYuntev
ReplyDeleteno, it's Reb Shua Leib, not YEHOshua Leib
and thousands of maskilim claimed the Torah as their inspiration
ReplyDeleteand thousands of Apikorsim claim the Shulchan Aruch as their inspiration
'In 1909, Rabbi Levi Yitzchak, Rebbetzin Chana and their three 'sons moved to Dnepropetrovsk, a huge military city 520 kilometers from Kiev, where Rabbi Levi Yitzchok became the rabbi of the city’s 25 synagogues and 50,000 Jews. He turned to Rabbi Zalman Vilenkin, asking him to teach his sons. Chana Shapiro is Rabbi Vilenkin’s daughter, recalling her parents’ descriptions of the children in their home.'
ReplyDeleteTaken from the site Tzigaleh linked.
Classic Chabasker revisionism
R'Levik was A Rov in Dnepropetrovsk not THE rov and the city was not a frum place at all, very shvach actually, not a rabbonus to be proud about
'and thousands of Apikorsim claim the Shulchan Aruch as their inspiration '
ReplyDeleteThis statement takes the cake for it's density.
HaGaon Reb. Yehoshua Leib Diskin was born in Horodno, where his father Reb Binyomin was rov and rosh yeshiva.
ReplyDeleteAlthough Reb Binyomin was extremely busy with communal matters and the yeshiva, he preferred to teach his son Torah himself rather than send him to a private melamed as everyone else did. Thus he taught him personally from a tender age until he was a grown man.
It is told that one year on Kol Nidrei night HaRav Binyomin was late for shul. The men sent to investigate found him learning with his son.
The father apologized saying he had made an account of his deeds of the past year and had not found any worthy deeds to present as merits on the Yom Hadin and he therefore quickly wanted to fulfill the mitzva of veshinantom levonecho.
Reb Yehoshua Leib was engaged before his bar mitzva and at the age of fourteen he married the daughter of HaRav Brode and lived with his father-in-law in Wolkowitz.
He became rov in various cities such as Lomza, Mezritch, Kovno, Shklov, and finally in Brisk from where his fame spread and whose name is associated with him until today: old Yerushalmim stand up as they mention his name in awe-- the Brisker Rov.
He was imprisoned following a libel against him and after being freed on Yom Kippur 5637 (1876) he decided that Succos to leave Russia for Paris and then on to Eretz Yisroel.
When he arrived there he refused to accept an official rabbinical post, but nonetheless in practice he led the city and all its affairs: the talmidim, kollelim, his famous battle against the Maskilim and against those who wanted to work in the fields during shmittah.
He was the first rabbi to protest the unfounded heteirim and he encouraged shmittah observance in Eretz Yisroel.
On motzei Shabbos Erev Rosh Chodesh Shevat 5658 (1898) he left this world and was buried the next morning on Har Hazeisim opposite the Har Habayis. Zechuso yogen oleinu!
shua is generally not used as a diminutive of Yehoshua by lutvacks, chassidim do use 'shia,see 'SHIA Hecht
ReplyDeleteYuntev
ReplyDeletethere's no cake to be had here.
Shulchan Aruch is not a sefer emunah, therefore, an apikores can rightfully claim that he listens to the shulchan aruch only.
Yuntev
ReplyDeleteHe was Rov in Dnepr of all Jews who wanted a Rov.
The Minchas Elozor and the Satmar Rov have just as much to be proud of in their towns.
Anybody who has any knowledge of history will tell you that he was known as Reb Shua Leib.
ReplyDeleteHershel why are you such a shallow partisan?Munkatsh was a frum city with hundreds of budding talmidei chachomim in the Michas Eluzers famous yeshiva,same for Satu Mare,Dnepropetrovsk,was way off the Jewish map,and yes, R'Levik was NOT the chief rabbi, he shared the rabbonus with another two rabbonim
ReplyDeleteWhat is so special about Yom tov in der vochen - don't most yomim tovim fall out on a weekday?
ReplyDeleteThe Minchas Elozor's Yeshivah did not have hundreds of budding Talmidei Chachomim.
ReplyDeleteAt least one of the Rabbonim was a Rav MiTaam. The other was whatever.
Yuntev and anonymous
ReplyDeleteYou've managed to totally disregard and ignore the whole point of this post.
was Kovno a frum city?
ReplyDeletewhat about Brisk?
'What is so special about Yom tov in der vochen - don't most yomim tovim fall out on a weekday? '
ReplyDeleteIt's a yiddish
saying
OK MR CARROT,
ReplyDeleteWHAT DOES THE SAYING MEAN?
bpunbound
ReplyDeletethis is a "family" blog, we don't touch material that may be objectionable to children
BP,
ReplyDeleteOK, OK, now I'm curius. What was the ad all about?
BP, do not bring it up here.
ReplyDeleteHT,
ReplyDeleteYou're sounding like TA again...
cmm
ReplyDeletehow so?
I must've missed the class on codes. What are you guys talking about?
ReplyDeleteHow can anyone attack Reb Levik. Who cares if he was "chief rabbi' or not. He was a great rav and a greater Jew. By the late 1920's he was the shdot rav.
ReplyDeleteDnepropetrovk was a large city with thousands of Jews many frum and many Chabad people. Was Rabbi Yakov Yosef really chief rabbi of NY ?
If you think everyone in Bergszas, Munkatch,, Chust , Ungevar and yes Sighet was frum , you would be interested in purchasing 770 from me too.
Reb Levik iz geven der zelber gadol vi di andere Litvishe rabbonim und efsher mit a shmitzik gresser.
Veho rayya in the 1930' all of Moscow Jews accepted hm as their Rav . Aval Lo Istaya Milso.
a gutten erev Shabbes
Nobody attacked R'Levik.
ReplyDeletePerspective was the focus.He was NOT chief rabbi of Dnepropetrovsk, the said city was of zero significance on the Jewish map and rov of Moscow in the mid thirties is very little claim to fame after most people could not observe shabbos and almost all scholars had long fled.
Historical perspective friends.
Btw how in heaven was R'Yaakov Yosef dragged into this??HE was revered DESPITE being Rov in NEW YORK, not because of it
the same way you dragged in Reb Levik into this conversation.
ReplyDeleteAnon
ReplyDeleteWe just finished saying that the other Rabbonim were Rabbonim MiTaam, yet you ignore it and again make your untrue point. Care to refute that?
Oh, ok, any non Chabadsker is rov mita'am?
ReplyDeleteI guess that's why you needed four chief rabbis in Kiev.
Interesting to note VERY COMMON that chabadsker self appoint or 'just decide' that their crony is chief rabbi, for example in a certain city in Italy, the local chabadsker 'paskens' on himself that he is chief rabbi, though all he really is is rov of a shul, same for the 'chief rabbi' of the former ussr.Rabbonim mitaam atsmom.Vekaheino, rabois
Am I the only one that thinks that anonymous isn't capable of making a coherent statement?
ReplyDeleteI see you really must be suffering from ADD, because you cannot keep to one subject for longer than 3o seconds. Please try and remember what the topic of this post was and comment regarding it. Also, if you're asked a question try and answer it if you can.
ReplyDeleteMy post regarding Lubabs penchant to 'grab' rabbinical positions, was quite clear.Don't mix up posts that you don't like with incoherent ones.
ReplyDeleteIf you really want to 'akshen ayn' we shall grant you that R'Levik was chief rabbi of Dnepopetrovsk a city uknown and unremembered that left zero mark on the Jewish world.
Does that historical revisionism make you happy??
It made as much mark as the Griz being Rov in Brisk.
ReplyDeleteYeah, right!!!
ReplyDeletebtw what is so scary about my points regarding failed messiahs that makes you delete any reference to it??
Aufen ganev brent dos hitel?
In Russia many towns had 2 rabbonim , 1 for Chassidim and 1 for the Olam or eilemas I would say. In Dnepropetrovsk Rav Levik was basically the Chabad rav (that is chosen by Chabad people)and I think its rabbi Berman or a name I can not recall who was the eilem rav. But both were the shdot rav.Their activities and responsibliltiy impacted on the whole Jewish community. Reb levik participated in amny rabbinic conferences before and after the Revolution.He was clearly among the gedole hoRabbonim of Czarist Russia,
ReplyDeleteIn Dvinsk botht the Chabad rav the Rogochover and the eilem rav Or Samaech were the shdot rav and the same was true everywhere.
Who said rav Levik was not the shdot rav in Dnep.?
I said he was ONE of the rabbonim in the city and was addressing the common chabadsker penchant to 'grab' positions .In the link that tzig provided regarding the videos about the rebbe, one headline mentioned that R'Levik was THE ROV OF Dnepopetrovsk, I pointed out that he was not THE rov, rather a rov,that Dnepo, was a freiyer city with very little claim to fame.
ReplyDeleteRegarding Dvinsk:The Rogatchover was NOT the Chabad rov, he was rov of the chassidim, though there were no real chassidim in the classical sense, they just davened another nusach.
Btw, much hay has been made by Chabad regarding the Rogatchovers shayches to Chabad.It has very little basis in truth.I would love to hear from anyone here if any of the Chabad rebbe is quoted by him in tsofnas pa'anech or anywhere else.True they would be in good company, since one of the only achroinim he quotes is the Chacham Tzvi.It is also obvious that because of a massive yeridas hadoiros, he had very little in common with Lubavitchs' leadership(I dare say that he was not fond of Harry Potter style works).
Apparently his father had some shaychus to Kopust, that'S how the Chabad 'grabbed' him.Typical
Anonymous
ReplyDeleteyou must be 150 years old and know exactly the feelings of people, whether or not they admired somebody, and whether or not they belonged to a group.
I would also ask you to use the names that the poster uses, if not I'll be forced to delete them.