In Sadiger
In Yerushalayim
In Boro Park
We had a quasi-reunion at the Vizhnitzer hall in BP. People coming over telling me how much they appreciate what I do, it was almost embarassing to hear so many compliments. I also heard some criticism, namely to tone down the "Snag" rhetoric. It was great meeting you all there.
Sounds like Chabadskers are again tooting their horn.I was there.Pathetic.It was, however, quite full,thanks to massive advertising and a very large contingent of backup Lubab, quite and a nice number of lost(or bored) souls such as the one and only Dov Shurin(who I like).The Chabadskers broke their teeth trying to seem 'heimish' by speaking broken yiddish.As usual the program was all about the Rebbe with very little about anything else.Timing was good as it was a long winter motseh shabbes when many people are bored.I did not stay for too long since it was mind numbing dumb and a missionary ploy to shlep to Lubavitch some naive individuals.
ReplyDeleteAnonymous said...
ReplyDeleteAnonymous said...
The hatred for Chabad that some of the respondents on this site demonstrate is so vile and disgusting it shocks me to the core. Countless times when there is a story about Chabad the scum of Boro Park and Flatbush creep out from the sewers they hide in to bash Chabad.
This is a story of a rabbi fed up of the discrimination against Judaism in his city and he has stood up and protested.
You may not agree with Chabad outreach but remember that there is a mitzvah of persumai nisah by Chanukah, especially in those communities where the Jewish population is ignorant of our religion.
December 10, 2006 3:51 PM
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Shulchon Aruch dictates the requirments of pirsumai nissa, not you or some half-wit who doesn't know the differnce between the window sill in his house and a public airport.
THERE IS NO MITZVAH TO PUT UP AN EIGHT FOOT MENORAH IN THE SEATTLE AIRPORT.
Stop inventing halachos to suit your needs.
December 10, 2006 10:13 PM
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And what does the Tzig think? Check out vosizneias here for the interesting case in Seatle http://yournies.blogspot.com/
In the Yerusholayim pics, Mendel Wechter still looks like a Satmarer.
ReplyDeleteAll this unprovoked "love" from you guys just as I was about to tone down the Snag rhetoric...
ReplyDeleteoh well
The Shulchan Aruch dictates the requirements of Prirsumei Nissa, absolutely. That's why Rebbes today light candles 3-4 hours after the Zman, right? because they follow the Shulchan Aruch, right? The fact remains that there is no greater Pirsumei Nissa than lighting in an airport.
You can all go and crawl back into your holes now, it seems like the spirit of Avigdor comes alive in Kislev to disturb Chassidus again.
As far as the Melave Malka being propaganda goes; I find iut interesting that the Satmar types, the ones that plaster the whole BP and Flatbush with 5 different varieties of signs about their 21 Kislev celebrations, that are attended by Satmarers only, all of whom get invitattions too, some of them 3 feet tall, with propaganda that would make the Soviets proud, are the ones that scream propaganda!
The Melava Malka is a beautifel event, the only one of it's kind, and you Umfarginner can all Plotz!
:( too bad I could not make it.
ReplyDeleteAs for backup Lubavitch, CH'ers were asked not to come in droves, and the pics clearly show a mixed crowd.
Dov Shurin shows up everywhere and anywhere when he is in town. A fun character.
Q. What kind of mental midget sticks in a comment about Menorah Lightings in Seattle when the topic here is a 19 Kislev Melava Malka?
ReplyDeleteA. A bitter, angry Snag, that's who.
Khof Kislev is Rav Hutner's z"l Yohrzeit. Last night there was a yohrzeit Ma'amar in Chaim Berlin. Funny how CB and 770 end ip celebrating the same night every year.
ReplyDeleteHirshel,
ReplyDeleteI honestly like an interesting dialogue - pro or con - but the stupidity that gets tolerated on this blog by the host is really boring & useless.
There is no event put on - by any group - less horn-tooting (to a fault actually) than the BP Y"T Kislev melave malke. Moreover, anyone who claims that the main-stream Lubavitcher representation was so dominant is obviously not only ignorant, but a liar.
I don't know why people who hate Lubavitch would feel compelled to come to, or comment, on it - but their pathetic focusing of their hatred and resulting comments causes me to be filled with a pity that cannot be expressed in words.
So, Faish, et all, here's to you: may you have a refua sheleima. may you have more useful outlets for your energies and interests. May you merit to have truly ehrliche children.
Now, please, all you souls filled with hatred, go get a life.
I am not a Chabad-nik and I did not attend in BP on Motzei Shabbos But it seems pretty poshut to me that Yud Tes Kislev transcends the confines of Chabad. The Maggid and the Rav/Ba'al Hatanya "belong" to Kl'al Yisroel much like the Chida, the Chofetz Chaim and the Ben Ish Chai. I can't see what all the fuss is about.
ReplyDeleteTo all the guys who have reading comprehension problems(including the host)
ReplyDeleteI copied and pasted the post about the Menora story in the Seatle airport, it was from vosiznaies with a link at the bottom some were pro som were con and this comment had the two sides of the debate.Since it was posted the news is all across the airwaves.At the bottom of the copied post I tried to ask the Tzig what he thinks about this case.It has nothing to do with YAT KISLEIV BUT NONETHELESS is a very current event.Get some brains guys and learn not fly off the handle at perceived insults.
'The fact remains that there is no greater Pirsumei Nissa than lighting in an airport.'
ReplyDeleteYou will probably be better off by opening a new post about this subject, but if I may,THEre are two parts to the debate about public menorah lightings, A)Do we 'make up' so to speak a new definition of pirsumei nisseh which chazal did not express, namely lighting in every public square, and B)aT WHAT COST?The shliach there has caused a massive backlash against Jews, does it pay?
Monsey, NY - An inspection by the Ramapo deputy building inspector found that a proposed synagogue on Forshay Road would actually be used as a yeshiva, which is not allowed under the town's zoning.
ReplyDeleteThe town's Planning Board had adjourned an October decision on the final site plan by Congregation Ateres Yisroel, which plans to convert a single-family house into a synagogue, until Deputy Building Inspector Steve Conlee could determine what exactly 30 Forshay Road would be used for.
The congregation, led by Rabbi Chaim Rottenberg, plans to remodel the two-story home into a synagogue to be used by about 25 to 30 young men to walk to and take part in religious services, prayers and study.
Work on the home began last year, and the congregation was cited by the town, for building without a permit.
At the Planning Board's October meeting, residents spoke out against the project. "The existence of a yeshiva will fundamentally change the face of the neighborhood," wrote Rabbi Yaacov Kaploun, who lives next door to the proposed project. "Privacy in our backyards, pool and decks will be lost when 25-40 unrelated young men move into a facility seven days a week. The peace and quiet on this residential neighborhood will be gone forever."
Given Conlee's memo, Town Attorney Michael Klein said, the congregation would either have to amend the site plan to conform to the town's zoning code for religious instruction and apply to the town's Zoning Board of Appeals for variances or ask the zoning board to review Conlee's decision.
The congregation's South Nyack-based attorney, David MacCartney, said he "strongly disagreed" with the determination.
"We think what's going on here is the government is sticking its nose into a religious institution and trying to dictate how the congregants practice their religion," MacCartney said. The congregation has not decided what to do next, and has not ruled out suing the town, MacCartney said.
Seilish
ReplyDeleteI don't see why that's "made up" Pirsumei Nissah.
The Shliach said that he did not intend that the tree be taken down, and is "shocked" at what transpired.
Read Here
Can someone verify if Rabbi Kaploun who is against the opening of the yeshiva is Lubavitch??If he is it is sad, the want gentiles to allow them to errect menorahs in all kinds of places and this Lubavitcher does not want to allow a yeshiva in his own neighborhood.
ReplyDeleteTzig
ReplyDeleteSorry for posting stuff you may feel is objectionable or unrelated, feel free to delete.
About Bogomilsky:I think he realized that he really overdid it and is trying to backtrack.I'm curious because I don't remember the New York area airports having a menora, does anybody?
wow! talk about a stretch!
ReplyDeleteYou see a story about a Yid trying to block a yeshivah from opening on his block, assume he's a Lubavitcher, and connect him to wanting Menorahs in Seattle! That's good work there Seilish.
Have you ever heard of Ateres Chinka/The Cheder? The court cases brought by frum neighbors on the block trying to block the expansion of the Yeshivah? They're Yeshivisher guys.
Hirshel
ReplyDeleteIt's made up pirsumei nissah because chazal said you should light in the tefach close to your doorway, no mention was ever made about lighting up in the town square.If chazal did not see fit to tell us about lighting in these places it would be apparent that this is not what they meant by 'pirsumei nisa'.Just my thoughts, I don't know .
Hirshel
ReplyDeleteKaploun is a Chabadsker name and such a Kaploun, an Australian resides in Monsey.Is it such a strectch that this is the same Kaploun which with this spelling is a very uncommon name??
Seilish,
ReplyDeleteThe fact of the matter is we can debate what pirsume nissa is "made up" and by whom from now to doomsday. The Shluchim are going to continue with their public Menorah activities and their opponents are going to continue to waste their breath opposing rather than doing anything positive in this regard. This discussion has been engaged continuously for decades and will not change anyone's mind at this late hour.
As you said above:
"It has nothing to do with YAT KISLEIV BUT..."
Correct! You can stop right there. This thread is about Y'T Kislev and not Chanukah. IOW, "Get some brains..." and discuss it on your own blog. If you don't have one go here and get one.
FWIW, it is good to see that the subject of the AR, his imprisonment and subsequent release and reinvigoration is considered Chashuve by others outside the world of Lubavitch. Unfortunately, I also see a substantial amount of revisionism among the academic decendents of the GR"A today. The way they tell the story is that the AR was informed upon by Maskilim who wanted to stop his teaching Torah. The informing by the Misnagdim (and I can certainly see why they felt they were justified at the time) has been redacted out of the story.
Runamok
ReplyDeleteSince when do you own this blog?Hirshel Tzig esquire, has seen the posts and deemed not to erase them.Go fly a kite.
If you had an iota of sense in your brain you would read about the story in Seatle and come back with some insight not drivel
"Since when do you own this blog"
ReplyDeleteMon d'poseil... Look how many postings you made in an attempt to hijack this thread into a disputation over public Menorahs.
"Hirshel Tzig esquire, has seen the posts and deemed not to erase them."
Yes, so he (and others as well) can ridicule you. As he said before...
"there is no greater Pirsumei Nissa than lighting in an airport.
You can all go and crawl back into your holes now"
PLONK!
Runamok
ReplyDeleteI see you are not a very nice guy.Oh well, what else is new..
Hirshel , Kabel es hoemes mimi sheomrah!
ReplyDeleteAll that was said was meant with gantz hartz.
Sorry about this late response bad news in the family. dont know if you heard
Hirshel , Kabel es hoemes mimi sheomrah!
ReplyDeleteAll that was said was meant with gantz hartz.
Sorry about this late response bad news in the family. dont know if you heard
I find it ironic that the snags here are talking about "Chilul Hashem" that a Shliach made due to a Kratzmich tree, when the real "Chilul Hashem" is unfolding now in the person of one Melamed in a prestigious Yeshivah on Ocean Parkway.
ReplyDelete''The rabbi has also offered to give the port an ---electric menorah---- to display, said his lawyer, Harvey Grad.
ReplyDelete"We are not going to be the instrument by which the port holds Christmas hostage," Grad said, emphasizing the rabbi never sought removal of the trees, but addition of the menorah.
The rabbi had received "all kinds of calls and emails," many of them "odious," Grad said, adding he was "trying to figure out how this is consistent with the spirit of Christmas."
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So the 'rabbi' has backed off.While backing off he has also given a Chabadsker hechsher for Kratzmich.Nu,nu.Oh btw, an electric menorah is pirsumei nisah?It's not kosher to light with, but again, we have already had a psak that an airport is the 'biggest' and best pirsumei nisah,
H.T. "embarrasing to hear compliments " I? you are not yet a real chabadsker,some thing is still left from your jewish past.
ReplyDeleteYes, an electric menorah is pirsumei nisa. Whether or not one can make a brocha on it (and who says one can't?). For that matter, a painting of a menorah is pirsumei nisa.
ReplyDeleteAs for Kaploun, it's by no means a "Chabadsker name". The Kaploun in this story and his brother are "Chabadskers", as you so charmingly put it, but AFAIK their father a"h was not; their shaychus to Chabad is through their mother and her family. So any relatives they have on their father's side, i.e. with the Kaploun name, are probably not Chabad. And it's all very well saying that one should never object to a yeshivah opening up next door, and in principle I agree, but it's not my house they're opening next to.
I remember hearing at a shiur once, that R Moshe Z"L paskened that bidieved one can make a brocha on an electric menorah.
ReplyDelete(Of course, R Moshe held that electricity is fire)
Millhouse, you say this Kaploun is a Lubavitcher and than in the same sentence you seem to imply that he is not?
ReplyDeleteHe IS a Lubavitcher but not originally, so the Kaploun name is not indigenous to Lubavitch. He Shtams from Lubavitcher Chassidim from his Mother's side.
ReplyDeleteAm I correct?
Well,ok,so the point being made was this:The Chabadsker are always fadreying areilims kep to put up a religous symbol they don't want to, when it comes to Chabadsker 'Rabbis' they themselves will not allow a yeshiva(!).So whAT DO YOU WANT FROM THE GOY? What happens is that the goy is forced into doing something they don't want to do and than a terrible sinah is caused.
ReplyDelete''The rabbi said, "we're thrilled the trees are going back up." But he said he was disappointed that Port officials chose not to put up the menorah as well, pointing out there are still several days until the start of Hanukkah. "I still hope that they'll consider putting the menorah up this year. But ultimately it's their decision."
Also did he say that he hopes the Port will apologize for mischaracterizations that led people to believe he was against having the trees displayed.''
Now , see what has happened when you have no seichel:This 'rabbi' is giving Kratzmich a hechsher! He is 'thrilled' wow! (In case you don't realize, one is not supposed to strengthen a goys celebration of avodo zoro).
I have written my opinion and you have a right to differ and explain yours,BUT, Tzig,I want to understand:You post a very silly post about the Satmar Rebbe being saved, it's ancient news,it's boring you added nothing at all to a famous story and btw the story with Kastner getting a dream is an ancient one.The 'glaich vertel' you added at the end about 'nishtakcho toras habesht' is infantile.I'm sorry for saying it this way.I've noticed that you will not touch even a whiff of controversy in Lubavitch while lashing out at all others.I'm not saying that you should write loshon horo, but for example, why would you not discuss if what this guy in Seattle did is overdone or not, what do other Lubavitcher chasidim think, etc.You could do the same with many other current events, issues.Instead you always go back to your 'favourites' ,bash Snags,Satmar,Stolin.
I'm not trying to insult personally , just giving you my honest opinion albeit with the writing of a chaider yingel, sorry, but I'm no good at expressing myself in writing especially with my weak english writing skills
Oh, what a 'Kidush Hashem' this K'ratzmech Rabbi has created?!?
ReplyDeletePersuma Nisa in it's biggest form, it hit the national news, 'n every goy in the US is wishing us a happy chanukah(go to hell).....
Anon from Villiamsburg
lubavitchers,
ReplyDeletelearn to listen to others. not everyone hates you...(although you hate eveyone who crticizes you):
is pirsumey nisso accomplished by adding more krazmach trees? by having a chanukah menorah next to a kratzmach tree? is this the "didan notzach" that you always thrill to find your names in the media regardless of what you do?
"happy that the trees are back..." what would be the reaction of the L had a "snag" said that? But by you everything is kosher...
Aryeh (and others)
ReplyDeleteThe whole incident was probably taken out of context, the Shliach threatened only to get the Menorah up, not to have the trees removed. I would imagine that the lawyer acted on his own behalf.
As far as Menorahs and trees go: The only way they could get a enorah up was to have it declared a non-religious symbol, similar to the tree. The Rebbe was of the opinion that it was worth it, abi the Pirsumei Nissah. The fact that there's a tree there is part of the reality we live in as citizens of the USA.
to Selish
ReplyDeletedo you know that there is a mitzva to light candles in Shul too?
Why is this topic not deemed by you to be worthy of serious, repectful discussion, while 60 year old history, which interests very few gets it's own post?
ReplyDeleteShould the 'Rabbi' have been thrilled by the kratzmich trees being returned?
Tzig, we all know that the torah says that 'shochad', causes people to be biased,right? It's natural that you have a bias towards Lubavitch (and, unfortunately a bias against snags, satmar etc)but are you at least AWARE of it? Look at you tepid response to an incident which I believe (and again this is my personal opinion)would be considered by most fairminded people to be a big boo-boo.He screwed up, should try nicely next year,vesholom al yisroel.Lubavitch has this tendency to muscle in and overshoot everywhere, giving Jews in general a bad reputation and Lubavitch a reputation amongst other Jews as loudmouthed and people who will not work with the rest of the community unless it's on Chabads terms
Anonymous
ReplyDeleteI dislike your generalizations, but since you write nicely I'll answer you.
What would you like Lubavitch to do? Scream from the rooftops that they're sorry? The local shliach did that. He said he didn't mean to have them removed, and that he's sorry about the whole incident. All he wants is to be Memale T=retzon Rabboy, and to be Mekayem the Mitzvah of Pirsumei Nissah of the Nes Chanukah.
The reason I brought up the 21 Kislev anniversary is because it is a topic of conversation, a very fair one.
Do I not get credit for not dragging the Agudah and Yeshivah Torah Temimah through the mud?
Tzig
ReplyDeleteI give you MORE credit for not bringing up the story about that chasenah, the details were so biased and one sided.
The Agudah and T.T. story for anyone who has a trop seichel has nothing to do about snags it's a problem that many yeshivas have/had and if it will effect every single kreiz.This is a word of caution for all the haters who think this story and similar ones will not effect them
which Chasunah?
ReplyDeleteWhere does it say there is a mitzvoh to light menoyras for non-Jews ? We are in golus, we are not in charge, it is not proper to force menoras on non-Jews. Or does Lubavitch hold that America is not golus since they think their Rebbe is Moshiach and he built his headquarters there ?
ReplyDeleteSnag2
ReplyDeleteYou sound like "The protocols" with the conspiracy theories, it does not bode well for your image.
I'm about to embark on a new campaign, smashing windows with Menorahs in them, especially in Snag neighborhoods. They think they're in Yerushalayim or Bnei Brak? Put it by the door!!!
The chasunah with rav landaus supervision
ReplyDeleteanonymous - your violent talk doesn't reflect well on you. Can you not disagree in a more civil manner ?
ReplyDeleteIf people put small menoiras in their windows that is on their private property. It is alot different than putting giant menoiras in a public place, in a non-Jewish area, in a land that does not belong to us.
snag2, "Where does it say there is a mitzvoh to light menoyras for non-Jews ?"
ReplyDeletestop acting "temevatteh" I'm sure you know, that there are plenty of Jews around to light for. & the many stories of how jews found their way back are known. besides the zman of lighting is according to Raboh bar bar Chuneh is עד דכליא ריגלא דתרמודאי who are not Jews.
although the reason according to some is not persumei niso.
ReplyDelete