A Wandering Jew describes his meal on the 1st night of Pesach this year.....
"I had two slices of pizza with sausage, and a lamb shawarma at this Turkish place. with orange soda!
from all the things I ate it was the orange soda that made it feel UnPesach'dik..
I made Hamoitzee.
Matir Asurim.
Al Achilas Chometz.
Un Mit Alle Kavonos.
And I Bentched. with Yaaleh V’Yovoy.
And I’m not Kidding."
The Brochos and Yaale VeYovoh mit Kavonos remind me of a story told of a bygone time: There once was a young man from a good Yiddishe home who joined the Bundisten. They have this custom, the Bundisten do, to have a "Yom Kippur Ball" where they eat, drink, and dance the night away, and are especially merry, including roasting a big, fat pig for good measure. One Yom Kippur Eve the young man comes home and announces to his father that he's returning from this big event where they ate and drank to their hearts' content, including Fressing Chazzer. The Father had but one question for his son:
Hust Chotsch Gehat Bentschen?
One aveirah that he has not as yet done is "hame'abed atzmo loda'as"
ReplyDeleteOf course it's bigger than the BT movement, Tzemach, the fact that there was ever a BT movement is something that's beyond my comprehension. Why anybody would join Orthodox Jewry on his own is a mystery. Now that young people are leaving in droves let's see if our Gedolim will step up to the challenge.
ReplyDeleteWhy somebody not frum would decide to join the Orthodox is a mystery. All he/she's doing is creating a whole lot of trouble for himself and generations to come.
ReplyDeleteThis movement ebbs and flows, but began with Haskalah as far as recent times go. Ein Chodosh Tachas Hashemesh.
ReplyDeleteoy. I am surpised he bentched though... maybe that is een more l'hachis because he is saying "thank you" for the teif and chametz on pesah
ReplyDelete'ובוצע ברך ניאץ ה
ReplyDeleteThe tragedy of human suffering is always troubling and people generally try to ignore it since it makes us uncomfortable. And while I maintain that the goings-on at 7FC is quite sad, these folks are not exactly paving new ground; they are in fact joining the majority of Jewish people as non-religious. To me, the rebel is the religious Jew, and even though these individuals may be traveling the opposite direction, this too has always existed.
ReplyDeleteBut the saddest part is not that they are or aren’t frum, but it’s the anger and unhappiness in their lives – this depresses me greatly. And I wonder: why is it that they don’t just seek and find meaningful lives doing whatever they do? They share the tendency with the chareidim, that that I so completely dislike, of defining so much of themselves by what they’re against. Why? Define yourselves by what you are for! Instead they think that they are getting-back at G-d our other Jews through activities that aren’t productive. Can anything be sadder?
Their thought that other Jews are eating this stuff up and are extremely interested is also sad. All people like some kind of attention – especially the love starved – but this is the kind of attention that the circus freak or horrific car crash gets; hardly something worth seeking.
I wish them all well; may we all find solace and peace in their lives bimheira biyomenu. Enjoy the shawarma!
Oops! That second-to-last line should read "may we all find solace and peace in OUR lives"
ReplyDeleteH man, where is the poster from?
ReplyDeleteI assume CE from your lack of empathy, that you have never gone through a tremendously traumatic experience, or clinical depression, or any other mental trauma, and take the road of "real men don't cry" and the attitude of the turn of the last century when real men shouldn't see a psychiatrist.
ReplyDeleteThe poster? I found it on the internet somewhere.
ReplyDeleteHmmmm,
ReplyDeleteFor those who need a doctor, I support and encourage them to do so. That goes without saying. But, what has that to do with anything? This is a blog. I am discussing the idea, not the individual personality – if we knew the people individually and had we all been using our real names than this would be a completely different interaction with completely different relationships.
None of us are real people here; we are limited to what we say and how we say it. Wandering Jew or Radloh or CE or HT are all ideas in our heads – therefore, I relate to most of them (except perhaps the bloggers that I know personally) on the level of the idea, and on that level the fact that we may all be in need of Phenobarbital or Lithium is besides the point.
And BTW, why do say that I had no empathy?
ReplyDeleteFarkert, I don’t share their specific method, which is pretty distasteful, but empathize with their suffering greatly.
Your correction changed your stance to one of empathy. I had commented before your correction was posted. Thank you for the change.
ReplyDeleteCE,
ReplyDeletecould you post your comment about doing something positive on sevenfatcow? it's something i think we oughtta discuss.
-shitalphin
My main problem with chareidi society today is that people are "strangers" to each other even though they daven in the same shul, identify with the same Rebbe, learn the same daf, etc.
ReplyDeleteTherefore, I find it incongruous when people claim that "frum society" is ostrasizing them, when most individuals in said society are already willingly ostrasized from each other. (and I am as guilty as anyone else, as such a derech suits my personality).
No one is pushing anyone away; in fact, the real avlah is that no one cares either way if Radloh comes to shul regularly or not.
milhouse:
ReplyDelete'ובוצע ברך ניאץ ה
Is that an open and shut statement?
I understand that G-d would "much rather" he not eat Treyf, but shouldn't we thank him for his food, no matter what the Kashruth status may be?
Millhouse is quoting a gemarah.
ReplyDeletewhich interprets the posuk this way :Ubotseah=someone that steals (the case is someone stole flour, kneaded dough, and now has removed the small part of every dough that has to be given to the kohen, (it has to be set aside from the other dough to be able to be consumed)he now wants to make the brocha required for 'hafroshas chalah)BERECH=when he makes a brocha IS , NIETZ HASHEM=As if he is actually blaspheming. I.e making a brocha on something prohibited to be done is also an aveirah.
There are various opinions amongst the early rabbis if this applies to bentchnig after eating treif (I think tosfos discusses it)
JJ, yes, it is an open and shut statement. Benching in such a situation isn't really thanking Hashem, it's thumbing ones nose at Him. It's like when you take someone's possession without permission, and you say "thank you" as you take it; it's meant sarcastically and is taken in that light. If one must do an aveirah, meileh, we've all got a yetzer horoh; but to thank Hashem for it is simply to boast of ones defiance.
ReplyDeleteTzig, I'm utterly shocked at your choosing to post a link to seven fat cows.
ReplyDeleteI had never before been to the website, nor will ever go there again.
You caused me to view filthy pictures.
YOU??? A CHOSID??? A CHABATZKER??
You have the gall to belittle Gedoley Olam on a constant basis. That does not bother me.
But when you place a link to a website which has dilthy pictures and filthy talk - your tru colors show.
I'm sure the Rebbe is very proud of you.
Lowlife.
YW
ReplyDeletefor some reason i find it hard it to believe that you've never seen worse pictures, with you on line all day and night getting the lastest breaking news for all the Yeshivishe guys and gals. I never linked to any of the posts that had any of those pictures, so you wandering around on that site was at your own risk.
As far as being a lowlife goes; maybe, maybe not. I'll leave that decision to people that actually know me.
A gut Moed.
yw editor and his online activity aside, I am having an issue with 7fatcows due to this. The writing is one thing, the pictures another.
ReplyDeletetHE point is that some of the pics were added after I linked to the site, and some of them you REALLY have to search for them to find them. So either you (YW editor) are a hypocrite or I'm innocent due to the pics being devorim shelo bo'u leOlom.
ReplyDeleteMilhouse
ReplyDeleteWhat about what mashpi'im would say to those who years ago Freid out:
פאר די שיעור תניא וואס דו האסט פארפעלט וועט מען דיר אויכעט שמייסען
i.e. that you may have done Kol Dovor Ossur but the fact that you didn't come to the shiur Tanya will be added to your list of indiscretions. Can we say the same thing here; that G-d does want you to wash and bentsh, even when eating chometz on Pesach ch"v?
Why would you be Notel Reshus when you have no Reshus? Why would you say Hazon Es Hakol when you have taken Mezonos not meant for you?
ReplyDeleteI understand the emotional and cultural reasons for it, and the joke was a good one, but why is a Shulchan Aruch of indiscretions being created? Should one say the end of Krias Shema Al Himita before commiting adultery or Issur Kedeisha? Should one recite the Mila Nusach when a doctor performs? Should one recite Yaale VeYavo when getting high?
The desire to bench on ma'acholim asurim might come from the checklists that children are given in preschool for their parents to check off how many times their children benched, etc. As they get older, their whole yidishkeit becomes an ever growing pile of checklists.
ReplyDeleteAttending a shiur Tanya before or after doing an issur is one thing; if you go before, maybe it will persuade you not to do the issur, and if it's after, maybe it will cause a hirhur teshuvah. But to make brochos and bench on a devar issur is simply to thumb ones nose at the Creator. Not only is it not a mitzvah, it makes the aveiroh greater.
ReplyDeleteIt's a machloikes rishoinim if you bentch after eating a dovor ossur.
ReplyDeleteרמב"ם הלכות ברכות פרק א הלכה יט
''כל האוכל דבר האסור בין בזדון בין בשגגה אינו מברך עליו לא בתחלה ולא 'בסוף
כתב הראב"ד ז"ל, טעה בזה טעות גדולה שלא אמרו שאין מברכין אלא שאין מזמנין עליהם לומר שאין להם חשיבות קביעות הואיל ואוכלין דבר האסור והוא כעין אכילת פירות שאין להם קבע לזימון אבל ברכה תחלה וסוף למה לא יברכו הואיל ונהנו עכ"ל.
Millhouse:I wish you'd open up a seifer before you 'pasken', you had a whole 'mehalech' on moshiach which was also based on very shaky grounds imho.
There is a lot more on this topic,I just brought down some marei mekomos