.....וואס די סאטמורים האבען אמאל געשריבען וועגן דעם בעלזער רב
דער עולם החסידות איז אויף רעדער! ס'טייטש? דער בעלזער רב האט געשיקט א מנין אידן - ובראשם שמעון וואלף דער גבאי - און נישט סתם אידן, נאר דיינים טאקע, דאס שענסטע און דאס בעסטע פון בעלז, און זיי געהייסען איבערבעטען בשמו דעם סאטמאר רב, בעל הויואל משה זצ"ל, אויף דעם וואס פאר 30 יאר צוריק האט זיך דער ב"ר אויסגעדרוקט אין א נישט-שיינעם אופן אויפ'ן סאטמאר רב. דאס איז דער לעצטער טריט וואס איז נאך פארבליבען אויף צו מאכען שלום מיט זיין שוואגער, דער סאטמאר רבי פון קר"י, ר' אהרן טייטלבוים, און אזוי מיט חסידי סאטמאר בכלל. דאס אז אין סאטמאר איז פארהאן נאך א גרופע וואס איז נישט אונטערטעניג צום רבי'ן ר' אהרן, דאס איז א פראגע וואס קיינער האט נאך נישט דער ענטפער דערצו... "כל הכבוד צו דער סאטמאר רב", שרייט מען, "אזא איש השלום!" דער גרעסטער רבי אויף דער וועלט. אנדערע גיבען גאר קרעדיט צו דער בעלזער רב און זאגען אז טאמער איז ער ביז היינט נישט דער מערסטע מוצלח'דיגע רבי איז ער יעצט אוודאי! נישט נאר האט ער פסיכעלאגען אין זיינע חדרים און ישיבות, ער מאכט שלום אויך! העפי דעיז אר היער אגען. איז נישט נאר דאס; די סאטמורים זעהען אויס בעסער און בעסער פון טאג צו טאג, זיי ווארפען אראפ פון זיך דער אלטער לעיבעל פון שלעכטע מענטשען און זענען יעצט אנשי שלום. מ' רופט ר' מיכל זעלבער צו כ"א כסלו פארדיס און מ' פארט אין חב"ד אין פאלם ספרינגס. והאמת והשלום אהבו. נישט אז מ'אפרישיעט נישט די אלע גוטע זאכען וואס מ'טוט.
א טראפ'קעלע דרך ארץ פאר'ן בעלזער רב ווייזען זיי נישט ארויס דא מיט'ן צעטל
וויל אייך דעמאלט זאגען אז דעם ציג קען מען נישט פארקויפען קיין הייסע לאקשען, ער עסט דאס נישט. ווער איז ער צו מאכען שלום בכלל? ווער דארף דען דיין שלום? וועם איז אנגעגאנגען די מחלוקת בכלל? ווער גלייבט דען אז דער שלום איז לש"ש? וואס וועט זיין פונעם שלום? נישט אז איך וויל ווייטער אנפירען מיט מחלוקת, ח"ו, נאר איך פארשטיי נישט די גרויסע שמחה בכלל! וואס איז ס"ה דא געשעהן? דער וואס האט לדעתם פוגע געווען אין סאטמאר רב'ס כבוד איז נישט געפארען צום ציון, ער האט געשיקט שלוחים. וואס איז מיט'ן "מצוה בו יותר מבשלוחו?" קען מען דען יוצא זיין דער חיוב אזוי? נאכאמאל, דאס מיינט נישט צו זאגען אז ער האט א חיוב פיוס בכלל.פארוואס זאל איינער וועלכע מ'האט פארשעמט פאר 30 יאר אין די גאסען - כפשוטו - דארפען איבערבעטן דער וואס זיינע מענטשען האבען עס געטוהן? צו דער וואס איז מכריז פאר' די וועלט אז ער איז דער ממלא מקום? איז שטיי און שטוין! וואו איז די שכל פונעם המון עם? וואו איז דער עם חכם ונבון אין די פרשה? פארוואס זעהט מען נישט דאס וואס איז קלאר ווי דער טאג?
{די קו"ק קעגן בעלזא}
און וואס איז מיט'ן צד שני אין סאטמאר? זיי דארף מען נישט איבערבעטן? זיי זענען זיך אינגאנצען מתעלם פונעם מחילה בעטען און פירען יעצט אהן ווייטער די מלחמה. דער רשע און עוכר ישראל מנשה פולאפ האט די וואך געפרעדיגט אין א העצע רעדע קעגן בעלז איבער 9 מינוט און האט זיי גערופען "מסיתים ומדיחים" און "משכילים" און נאך ארגער. זעהט אויס אז זיי נעמען נישט אהן די מחילה. איז וואס טויג אונז אזא שלום?אז איר גלייבט נישט און האט 9 מינוט צו מבטל זיין הערט אויס ווי פולאפ איז פוער פיו ווי דער נידערטרעכטיגע יונג וואס ער איז. דאס איז סאטמאר! דאס איז וואס מיר האבען געהערט אלע יארען וועגן סיי וועלכע קרייז וואס איז נישט געפעלען פאר סאטמאר. טאמער זענען די בריונים מוחל אויף דעם וואס די בעלזער האט זיך און זיין דרך און זיינע פעטערס און זיידעס פארטיידיגט וועט מען קענען גלייבן אז מ'זוכט צו מאכען שלום. ביז דאן איז עס גארנישט מיט ווידער נישט. וואס מ'זעהט היינט בראשית ר' אהרן פון קרית יואל איז לדעתי נישט סאטמאר. ס'איז א פארוואסערטע נאכמאכונג וועלכע האט פארלוירען דעם מהות און איז נאר דומה צום ארגינעלן. סאטמאר
אהן קנאות און שעלטעריי איז קיין סאטמאר נישט! אזוי זאגט די ציג! וועם עס געפעלט נישט קען זיל טרעפן א נייע ציג.
ווען איך וואלט געווען א בעלזער חסיד וואלט איך זיך געשעמט מיט דעם גאנצען צערעמאניע וואס איז דא פארגעגאנגען. מיין רבי האט דעמאלסט ס"ה זיך אנגענומען פאר זיינע הייליגען פעטער זצוק"ל, וועמענס מאנען די סאטמורים האבען אין יענע צייטען שוין 30 יאר געשלעפט אין די מאראסט. ער האט אים נישט פורס בשם געוועהן. ער האט נישט אנגעשמירט קיינע גאסען מיט מיאוס'ע גראפיטי כמנהג סאטמאר. ער האט סה"כ געזאגט א ווארט צוויי וועגן שטאפ-גענז. שוין. איך אליין וואלט עס נישט געזאגט. זייט ווען איז דער סאטמארער קהילה און עדה החרדית דער יורש פון רבינו החת"ם סופר איז מ'דארף זיי איבערבעטן ווען מ'טשעפעט זיך מיט'ן חת"ס? דער בעלזער אליין איז דאך א האלבער אונגארישער מצד אמו תליט"א. טאמער וויל ער און טאמער שפירט ער זיך נייטיג, קען ער פארען קיין פרעשבורג און דארט איבערבעטען.ער איז פונקט אזא בר דעה אויף אונגארישקייט און חת"ם סופר'קייט ווי די אנשי סאטמאר. די סיגעטער קינדער זענען קיינמאל נישט געפארען לערנען אין פרעשבורג, זיי איז גוט געווען אהן די חת"ם סופר ותלמידין אויך, טא וואס ווערן זיי אזוי צוקראצט פון די פאר ווערטער וואס דער ב"ר האט ארויסגעלאזט פון מויל?
מנשה פולאפ אין לאנדאן לעצטנס פרעדיגט קעגן בעלזא
Sorry for using a Holocaust analogy, but it's like Paris 1940, when AH dragged out the same railroad car that the Germans were forced to sign the Treaty of Versailles, and forced the French to sign their surrender there. That's what the "Bakoshas Mechilleh" ceremony here looked like. The only way to make this worse was if the Satmar Rebbe himself was there to "accept the apology." Thank G-d they didn't do that. If I was a Belzer Chossid I'd be terribly embarrassed and ashamed. No matter what I thought of my Rebbe and no matter how much I love Belz and stand up for its honor. What he did back in 1982 was to defend his uncle's honor. In no way was he beholden to the Eida HaChareidis, just like his uncle decided to deny the kanoyim when they requested/demanded that he wear the Jerusalem garb. He could have his own Beis Din and Kashrus system if he so pleases. Now he embarrassed his holy uncle all for his own silly ego, and to please their wives, probably. His and Teitelbaum's. Such an inferiority complex he has? The Satmar Rebbe himself couldn't understand why his shvogger wants so much to meet with him and to make peace. I fail to see what the reason for celebration is here.
Sorry.
First of all, you have the Halachic aspect wrong. Here's what the Rav writes on such matters:
ReplyDeleteשו"ע סי' תר"ו ס"ה שרייבט דער תניא:
ואם מת מי שפשע כנגדו מביא עשרה בני אדם ומעמידם על קברו ואומר בפניהם, חטאתי לאלקי ישראל ולפלוני זה שפשעתי כנגדו, וצריך שילך לשם יחף.
ואם הוא חוץ לשלש פרסאות מן קברו אינו צריך לילך בעצמו לשם אלא ישלח שלוחו שיבקש ממנו מחילה בעבור השולחו בפני עשרה בפני אדם.
אין ס"ו שרייבט דער תניא בזה הלשון:
ואם חרפו לאחר מיתה אינו צריך לילך על קברו אלא מבקש ממנו מחילה במקום שביישו.
Perestroika, who knew. Could you give some links to give some background on these new developments.
ReplyDeleteSecondly, it’s false to say that Belz did anything with one of the two (or 3, 4, 5) factions in Satmer. All he did was lifnim mishiras hadin sent a minyan to the gravesite of the “old Satmer rabbe” and asked for forgiveness.
ReplyDeleteNo public move was made with either faction. Even though this forgiveness pilgrimage came on the behind-the-scenes request of R’ Aaron of Satmer, the same request would have been made by any Satmer rabbi, who would feel obligated to defend the honor of its patriarch, just like Belzer rebbe was compelled to do 30 year a ago.
And I’m sure Belze rebbe will be extending a hand to any Satmer faction, to the primitive Stone Agers as well as to the refined and civilized ones (paraphrasing you, Tzig). It is up to each Satmer rebbe to decide whether he wishes to reciprocate or not. But the last 24 hours we so developments onfolding between the current Belz rebbe and the Satmer rebbe R' Yoel. That's it.
But what I don’t understand, Tzig, is that in your last post you mock Meah Sheorim and Beis Shemesh as backward. In this post, you’re grumpy with Satmer for being watered down and civilized. You’re accusing Belz in being too polite and savvy on diplomacy. Your purism is puzzling, I’d say.
Tzig said: "דער רשע און עוכר ישראל מנשה פולאפ האט די וואך געפרעדיגט אין א העצע רעדע קעגן בעלז איבער 9 מינוט און האט זיי גערופען "מסיתים ומדיחים" און "משכילים" און נאך ארגער. זעהט אויס אז זיי נעמען נישט אהן די מחילה. איז וואס טויג אונז אזא שלום?אז איר גלייבט נישט און האט 9 מינוט צו מבטל זיין הערט אויס ווי פולאפ איז פוער פיו ווי דער נידערטרעכטיגע יונג וואס ער איז
ReplyDelete----------------------------
And who are you exactly if not a פוער פיו in one vein on the same day to belittle true gedoli yisruel: Reb Ahorn RAK! Rav Weiss! And yes Menashe Philip! He to is a talmid cuchim and yirei shumayim! סוכ"ס all he says is what the holy RYT his rebbe! said thousands of times! 70 true gedoli yisruel + rav wosner in a separate letter vouch that the belzer ber is an apikoris!
כל המבזה תלמיד חכם אין לו רפואה למכתו
SR z"l writes:
כל מחלוקת שהיא לשם שמים, סופה להתקיים. ושאינה לשם שמים, אין סופה להתקיים
איז דער פשט
That a מחלוקה שהיא לשם שמים the מחלוקה will last! And the fractions will not make peace with them! ושאינה לשם שמים the מחלוקה will not last and the fractions will make peace !!!
My advice tzig stay in the lubab slide..! where your opinions are welcome, or in the similar but different camp by the litvakes..! Stay out of satmar! you have no clue what satmar is!!!
Tzig: מנשה פולאפ אין לאנדאן לעצטנס פרעדיגט קעגן בעלזא
ReplyDeleteThe vid is of Zalman Leib Philip you're cursing Menashe Philip ?
מתוך כעסך בא לידי טעות?
ברכות כט ב: לא תרתח ולא תחטי
it's Menashe. the mistake is on youtube
DeleteTough day to be a Belzer especially a Belzer dayan. All the hate and loshon horah of the last 30 years for naught. And now to have to go to the Satmar Ruv's kever,ground zero, what a humiliation. What's nezt? With a bipolar Rebbe who knows.
ReplyDeletethe belzer is trying for severl years to make peace with the eida so they can relieve him of his achrayis for his lousy hechsehr, he may think that this can be a stepping stone...
ReplyDelete+ rav wosner in a separate letter vouch that the belzer ber is an apikoris!- source please
great picture on top.
ReplyDeleteTzig, nobody has such a long memory to remember what and who started the fight, nobody cares anymore who was right.
ReplyDeleteThe Belzer is scoring major points by the masses for the "Great Kiddush Hashem", for his "Great Humility", for his "Great Wisdom".
In the eyes of the masses its quite simple. Satmer Rebbe Zatzal was great Tzaddik, Belzer Rebbe (who the masses anyway believe is always progressive) humiliated himself to ask mechilah. The masses have forgiven him, they will forever remember "The Gadlus of Belzer Rebbe", Pesach Krohn and the Hamodia will have this in a permanent template on any article regarding Belz. And the Rebbes fundraising operation will increase by 15 percent.
Plus he gained a bigger shiduchim pool for his constituents. Plus hechsheirim, his chasidim can actually begin eating kosher again, plus he can farm out his poskim, mechanchim, psychologists to new territories.
Tzig, when someone scores a good shot you need to have the decency to give them the credit they deserve.
LikeWhatever
Achtung! This bipolar Bear is deceiving and dangerous!
ReplyDeleteThe issue with the belzer bear דוב שובב שלא קרא ולא שנה, ופוסע על ראשי עם קדוש is not about their desecrating the holy name of the chasam sofer or from RYT z”l! Yes, this bear likes to make himself the center of attention! But No “it’s not about him” Belz סר מן הדרך 60+ years ago! The torch of uncompromised יודישקייט before WWII was belz!, that they loosed to RYT! read Satmar after WWII when the belzer slide started! To be relevant their butlers (gaboim) manipulated the old blind reb aron z”l and made him to indorse anything what’s against the SR! And with that to stay relevant! Times have changed and belz became an empty suit standing for nothing! ok they are עוסק בפרי' ורבי' but so does others so numbers doesn’t matter anymore, to stay relevant this Bear is using bombastic statements of shouts and twists from time to time, political mechanisms, turns 360 degrees when necessary, flip flops like a bear when needed, with no shame or guilt just to confuse his prey! He did so on numerous occasions and when the conned woke up that this is the old bear with new tricks! He is content with his deceive and starts again with his binges…, and flops back to his agenda of haskala! Hoping that his maneuvers are not becoming transparent!
! BEWARE OF THE BEAR HE IS DANGEROUS!
והבער ריק אין בו מים, אבל נחשים ועקרבים יש בו
anon 9:29, "+ rav wosner in a separate letter vouch that the belzer ber is an apikoris!- source please"
ReplyDeleteI have a copy of the letter.
360 degrees?
ReplyDeleteJingle
ReplyDeleteעמך אנכי בצרה but I think once the dust settles the Belzer will come out better and the more Aron rubs the Belzer's nose in the more vindictive he will come to look.
The Ruv ain't gonna change and if he can present himself as a peacemaker in his golden age so much the better. Once the summit takes place (I hear Aron's in Israel for Shabbos Shirah) I'm sure Belz will trump him. The few wimps behind Aron's chair are no match for the Belzer's Shimen Volf and the rest. Moshe Friedman efsher but not that lot.
And as for the Satmarer's famous thugs they're all on facebook these days chasing Beis Rochel girls and if not they're fighting each other so I doubt they'll be contributing too much.
Are you trying to come across as a disinterested third party. Besides the fact that Satmar fought with Lubavitch too, there is no difference between Belz and Satmar. They both started as Biryonim. In Europe people were scared of Belz like in America in the 60s everybody was scared of Satmarer biryonim. They drank the blood of the Munkatcher and of everybody who did not show ther party the correct deference. You can blame R' Yissochor Dov and R' Aaron for this just like you blame RYT. Right and wrong do not start by what the person held of Lubavitch and the Rebbe. That is just your negi'us and you are expected to rise above that.
ReplyDeleteThis bear of a rebbe is in the wrong profession his talent is not relevant in עולם היהדות But Hollywood may employ him for his shticks and knacks! Or his architectural knowledge and style bay be useful in Rome which is crumbling!
ReplyDeleteהערטס מיך אויס טייערע אידן. ציג (אקעי אקעי, "דער ציג") האט א פראבלעם. ער האט לעצטענס באקומען צופיל מטומטמים נאכפאלגערס, וואס גלייבן אין רעבענעכסענוגענאלייני אזוי ווי ציג אין רממ"ש. דאס שאפט א פראבלעם, ווייל איטליכער ווארט וואס ציג שפרעכט אנטקעגען סאטמער, ווערט גלייך אויסגעטייטש דורך די קליינגעפיגע ווי א מלחמה לה' בעמלק און תיכף ומיד הערט מען די יואלישע קול'עכלעך שרייען "אונזער רעבע איז די בעסטער/שענסטער/גרעסטער רעבע פון די גאנצע וועלט!" די מהדרין שרייען "נישטא נאך אזא גאט-- עההם, רעבע ווי אונזער רעבע". ציג, (וגם אני הקטן) האבן גאר ווייניג נערווען צו די קליין קעפיגע יואלישלעך וואס חוץ א גוט שטיקל לשון הרע אויף "אהרן'ען" אינטערעסירט זיי גארנישט. איז ציג אויפגעקומען מיט די דאזיגע פאוסט כדי אונטערצוציען די יואלישלעך אביסעל און זיי אוועקנעמן די אפעטיט אנצוגיין מיט זייערע קליינקעפיגע געשרייערייען. בינו זאת
ReplyDeleteP.s. Whoa, I never though of myself as a conspiracy theorist but it seems that this time I hit it on its head!
Yankel, you obviously know little of Belz. We can argue about RY"D but Reb Aharon fought with no one. The Munkatcher started with the Belzer and the Belzer didn't take it lying down.
ReplyDeleteEven if Belz had their shkotzim they also had their serious talmidei chachomim like the Tarnopoler Rov, the Tshbiner Rov and countless others whereas the world is still waiting for a single world-class talmid chochom to emanate from Satmar. And of course no Belzer Rebbe would ever put his name to the trash that is Va'Yoel Moshe.
Ende Tsadik 10:24, "they're all on facebook these days chasing Beis Rochel girls"
ReplyDeleteStay where you are, facebook the place for Ende Tsadik'm.
anon 10:35, "Whoa, I never though of myself as a conspiracy theorist but it seems that this time I hit it on its head!
ReplyDeleteMy advice, Keep your day job!
Ende Tsadik 10:24 "עמך אנכי בצרה but I think once the dust settles the Belzer will come out better"
ReplyDeleteThe after shock.. between belz and satmar came when the berich moshe went to visit this bear thinking that he is sincere in bringing back the old belz, when the berich moshe realized he was deceived he almost annihilate him with his strong action against him! I suspect this may happen again! Although as you mentioned this aron rebbe may be subdued by than c"v!
On the other hand the watch out when a subdued paper tiger wakes up!
Ende Tsadik 10:38, "And of course no Belzer Rebbe would ever put his name to the trash that is Va'Yoel Moshe."
ReplyDeleteימש"ו
The winners will be Zalman Leib,Bnai Yoel and the kanoim.The holy Yid will have a field day. Aren T. will look like a Zionist and will be the big loser.At the end of the day,Satmer is kannous. That is their mehus. So after a detente with Belz alot of his people will have a major identity crisis. Luckily,they could go to a Belzer sicholog for reduced-rate psychoanalysis.
ReplyDeleteפיסחאלאג
ReplyDeletewhy is it so difficult to say פסיכאלאג?
Where is our friend Belz fin amool when we need him to give us Bobov's position?
ReplyDeleteHirshel Tzig 9:09, “it's Menashe. the mistake is on youtube”
ReplyDeleteReb Menashe or Reb Zalman Leib, both are saying what they heard from their rebbe! משנה תורה: אל יאמר דבר שלא שמע מרבו and you’re saying what your rebbe heard from his rebbes Hildesheimer and Sorbonne . ראו מה בין בני לבין בן-חמי
Menashe is an עוכר ישראל שעתיד ליתן את הדין
ReplyDeletedon't pin this on RYT
"און וואס איז מיט'ן צד שני אין סאטמאר? זיי דארף מען נישט איבערבעטן"
ReplyDeletewhy when he came to the Tzion do you say he asked forgivness to 1 side of satmar only.
Unless you know something we dont. all he did was going to the Kever of Reb Yolish and Beirach Moishe.
anon 11:40 "Aren T. will look like a Zionist and will be the big loser"
ReplyDeleteKlainer kup, as of now AT didn't do anything wrong (neither the belzer) and didn't reciprocate yet, assumptions aside, so as hirshel says hold up your פסיכאלאג'ן
אזוי זאגען מענטשען אויף די גאס
ReplyDeletebesides
זענען זיי בכלל געווען ביים ברך משה? האבען זיי זיך בכלל אויסגעדרייט אהין? און וואס איז מיט'ן רביצין?
Please post the letter of rav vosner!!!
ReplyDeleteI should post it?
ReplyDeleteMarcy, are you off your head? How should he apologize to both sides? Turn round to R' Yoilish's head for Aron and his ... for ZL? Or the other way round?
ReplyDeleteThey went to Reb Yoilish only. The Beirach Moshe barely registers in Satmar so mikolshken in Belz.
Hirshel,Good question. Only my p'-sy-chiatrist knows the answer.
ReplyDeleteHirshel Tzig - הירשל ציג said...
ReplyDeleteMenashe is an עוכר ישראל שעתיד ליתן את הדין
And who is asking your opinion at the בי"ד של מעלה ??? I have never see you saying it on a certified עוכר ישראל like KOOK!
הגאון הגדול ר' אברהם יצחק הכהן קוק ,
ReplyDeleteזצ"ל האט קיינעם נישט בארעדט
פון א טעות ווערט מען נישט קיין עוכר ישראל
מנשה קומט נישט צו זיינע געשניטענע נעגל
Post the letter of rav vosner. Hundered percent!
ReplyDeletehe has since retracted that letter, so there's no point
ReplyDeleteCmon, smacht nisht ois. He musta had a good reason for writing it and you can post the retraction too!
ReplyDeletesatmar williamsburg is itching for a fight basically reb zl is in the same position his father was when the berach moishe was yoiresh the rabisteva from the veyoiel moishe to get things going they needed a maroocha and they hit the jackpot with belz. the problem is the good old days aint coming back 1) the hisachdes hurabunim has'nt got the teeth it used to have in satmar itself its irrelevant 2)belz bashing with a rebbe over 60 wont work like it worked with a 30 year old 3)belz dont really need the peace and satmar neither so maybe the belzer rebbe does mean leshem shumayim
ReplyDeleteAnon
ReplyDelete"
כל המבזה תלמיד חכם אין לו רפואה למכתו"
Did Menashe ever write a torah piece that is not polemic?
in all his pieces his learning lekanter veien loi trufa lemaakosoi.
All his teaching jobs in satmar oriented yeshivahs lasted a week or two. He could not explain a little hilchas shabos question of a bochur.
Eventough this yeshivas were from the extreme faction of Satmar.
Don't sell us a Megale punim Betorah sheloi Kehalocha as a talmid chochem
Probably the nagging sisters pulled this off.
ReplyDeleteToday,There are no pusichalogen available. They are all at Belz helping them deal with the trauma.
"My advice, Keep your day job!"
ReplyDeleteI'll think about it. Meanwhile take a look at all the bipolar bear 'jokes' and you'll see what i meant when i said Metimtumim. The Belzer (Berele if you wish) made an awesome political move which makes him a winner, Aron a loser and Zalman Lieb'n a naar. he should run for president.
Why are you so cynical? maybe the Bleza rabbi decided what he did 30 years ago was wrong and is trying to make amends, did it ever cross your mind?
ReplyDeleteI guess he feels now that the way he spoke about RY"T and how he handled the fight was wrong and he decided that he wants to apologize before he dies and since he can't make the trip he had 10 people go for him מה כל הרעש?
Why are you trying to make it for a political statement or chess move and you quote The Satmare Rebbe that he couldn't understand why his shvogger wants so much to meet with him! I hope it's not a true quote but even if it is he his guilty with the same חטא as you
This guy is just trying to do תשובה and ask forgiveness for what he thinks he did wrong
it's not a reason to celebrate and it's not a reason to be ashamed
If the Belzer is the great Ohev Shulem, why does he not ask for forgiveness from the Great Reb Shulem Brander the rosh yeshiva that his uncle the Belzer Ruv and his fatherthe Bilgarayer Ruv handpicked for Rosh Yeshiva.
ReplyDeleteHe was the de facto Belzer chosid , from the smetene that belz had even in the utopian world of the pre war yoshvim.
The Chazon ish was in awe of his torah,He was the greatest Matikie shemua that Belz had to offer.
Just look in his shmussen that are printed.
His kever is not far from his vacation home in Cesseria.
He was physically thrown out of the yeshiva building that he build, like a dog.
It all happened when The Ruv went for vacation in Swiss and his goons with Yankel Bronner as the leader, started throwing metal chairs. And Reb Shulen ran for his life.
It all reminds me,of a famous Rebbe in Hungary, who was constantly fighting his fellow rebbes and rabunim, with curses
etc..
Once he started a new fight with Rav Y Z Duschinsky, His advisors told him Rebbe.. it is a little too much, we can not fight with the whole universe,
so he send a delegation to beg for forgiveness,
Rav Duschinsky asked the delegation,,Are you people traveling like this, Meyir Leyir Umikefar Lekfar.....
יש כמה עשרות קהילות ומנהיגים בארץ שמעולם לא היה להם שום שייכות עם העדה או עם סאטמר בכלל, ומאז ולתמיד הלכו לבחירות הטמאות, ולקחו כספים מהממשלה הציונות וקהילת סאטמר אמנם לא חיבקו להם אבל נהגו כבוד ונימוס עמם וחילצו ידים ואפילו היה פגישת אדמור"ים מפעם לפעם, רק חינכו בסאטמר. שהם תועים ביסודות אמונתינו הק' ובחרו להם דרך עקלתון שפוגע בעקרי דתינו, וילד שגידל בסאטמר צריך לנהוג דרך פרישה עמם, ויערה ה' עליהם רוח טהורה. הבעלזאר היה היחידאי שפער פיו בלעג ודברי שמצה ובזיון על הגה"ק מסאטמר בעל דברי יואל זצ"ל ומאוחר יותר על ממשיכו וממ"ק הבעל בירך משה זצ"ל וגם הכריז ששחיטתם נבילה ופיגול הוא, ועוד ועוד שאי אפשר לפורטם פה כי הזמן יכלה. וע"ז יצא הקצף מהסאטמרים על קהילת בעלזא ורבם עמם, ומאוחר החרימו ונידו אותו (ולא אאריך עכשיו בנושא שקהילת בעלזא יסודתם בהררי קודש ושייכו לקהילת הקנאית מעולם עד שהאדמור העכשווי משך אותם לתוך הבוץ)וכהיום כשהבעלזאי רוצה לחזור העגלה ולעשות שלום מאיזה סיבה שהיא, אם משום מצבו/מחלתו או ד"א, ורוצה לפגוש עם האדמור מסאטמר שליט"א, התנה האדמור תנאי קודם למעשה שמקודם שנערך איזה פגישה או דו"ד, עליו לבקש מחילה עם מנין מרבותינו הקדושים זצולה"ה, וכשרואים שהבעלזאי נכנע ושלח עשרה מדייניו ומוצי"ו ממרחבי העולם וע"ג מזכירו האישי הרב קליין מסלתה ומשמנה מחסידות בעלזא לעלות לציוני האדמור"י סאטמר ולחנן בקשת מחילה למחול ולסלח על פגיעתו בקדושי עליון זה נצחון של ממש לקהילת סאטמר המעטירה
ReplyDeleteIt's truly amazing. The whole story with "foie gras" story was not about R' Yoilish, his nephew or חת"ם סופר. It was a (IMHO, justified) בזיון of the Hungarian סטאדע בהמות. The Teitelbaum family has as many chassidic credentials as Rokeachs, whatever these may be. R Moshe, to his credit, stepped up to defend his community. OTOH, Aron is a regular chassidishe rebbe, who couldn't care less whether his shvoger and fellow rebbes' union member spit in the face of 95% of Satmar and 60% or so of Belz chassidim. BTW,Belzer is not about to ask for mechila from the Magyars as a group. What is indeed interesting is that AFAIK not a single Hungarian Belz chossid left after the story. But I guess, some people, while being on the receiving end of certain physiological activity, think it's raining.
ReplyDeleteכל המבזה תלמיד חכם אין לו רפואה" "למכתו
ReplyDeleteI love these satmorim who are always "posel b'mumayhon".
bizuy tamiday chachomim??! who has done this par excellance over the last 60 years?
But of course! first you make the talmid chuchim "ois t"C" & then you have free rein..
yidden if you want Moshiach to come, you had better stop this blog. It is an unbelievable chillul Hashem. If you can resist the Loshon Hora at least not so public!
ReplyDeleteThe Belzer Ruv, had all his life a juvenile streak in his leadership.
ReplyDeleteHe never had to get up and talk on the Satmar Ruv by name.
The Klausenburger ruv who was maligned by the Satmar Cannibals on a personal level, they threw manure on him,The poured water on his erev pesach matzohs, after his holy avodas hashem of hours baking a few matzohs.
But he cried and spoke about it by his torah, but never mentioned a name.
So was the Lubavicher Rebbe handling these cannibals, never mentioned a name in public or in a letter.
The Satmar ruv never mentioned his enemy list by name, even there are tapes that leaked of his private conversations, that he curses his enemies aggressively, but it was private.
This is called professional leadership.
But he was juvenile 30 years ago, and juvenile with the mechila beten..
Yidden please stop the chillul Hashem. If you can't resist the LH at least do it privately.
ReplyDeleteIMHO, it's very simple. the Belzer is trying to clear the decks for his son. He's not doing well physically. AFAIK, he disappeared from simchas torah until chanukah. So he's cleaning up old baggage so the succession will go smoother. it's not costing him much, the aida hachereidis is much weaker today, RAT has to deal with satmar issues, so it's a simple way to clear this thing out.
ReplyDeleteAfter seeing klausenberg and satmar get together, he figured why not me. that war was far more vicious and personal and they buried the hatchet, so if all it takes is sending a minyan to the kever, go for it. the mechila was not for making a BD, it was for some words spoken at the "shtayendike toirah".
The bottom line is the belzer is in a much stronger position today than the either satmar. he's got a powerhouse chassidus, yungeleit helping each other with parnossah, a solid chinuch system, the lowest dropout rate in chareidi circles, so this is a minor nuisance to him.
Anon
ReplyDelete"The bottom line is the belzer is in a much stronger position today than the either satmar. he's got a powerhouse chassidus, yungeleit helping each other with parnossah, a solid chinuch system, the lowest dropout rate in chareidi circles, so this is a minor nuisance to him."
its a myth..
Watch for the abdication of the century
ReplyDeleteyou heard it here first, folks!
ReplyDeleteabdication of the Belzer throne coming soon.
there are rumors that he contacted Elish Englander for a agreement to divide the rebisteve into 80/20
ReplyDelete80 percent Reb Yisocher Dov will be rebbe, 20 percent Reb yehoshua. RYD is not in the rebisteve mood all the time anyway.
So far Elish want more percentage, but the negotiations are on the table,
Shimon Volf is working very hard
I understand that this is tchikavve nayes that the 2nd and 3rd generation of Hungarian survivors' children enjoy discussing. The truth,however,is that chassidus is meaningless in a world where there are scientific and medical breakthroughs on a daily basis. These breakthroughs don't come from the kollelim in KJ or Bkln but from secular academic institutions.The Hassidic world is living in 1750 while most of us are living in 2012.To willfully keep thousands of young men and women ignorant of science,history,psychology,mathematics,etc. is almost too hard to believe.If the "ignorant ones" were at least kind and caring and erlich in business, well,maybe we could accept some of the ignorance. But there's nothing here.Is our faith in Judaism so fragile that some knowledge of history and science will bring the whole structure crashing down?How many students in chassidishe yeshives become roshei yeshiva or dayyanim? Most spend their time in a "holding pen" until they get married,have a houseful of kids,and will never ever have the time to think about anything besides paying the bills,getting food stamps,and hoping the "Rebbe" will smile at you at the tish.In America they used to say that "a mind is a terrible thing to waste..." Belz,Satmar,Ger,it's all a big waste of time.At least Lakewood and the Litvishe do produce some real talmidei chachomim though there's plenty to talk about there,too.
ReplyDeleteAnon said its a myth.."
ReplyDeleteI heard it from total ousiders with no ax to grind. most observers will say he's not a kodosh v'tohor, but he's definitely a gr8 community organizer. most of his yungeleit have parnossah, and he's got a system to deal with bochurim vos halten nisht beim lernen. it's not nirvana, and i'm sure there's major issues inside. but he's leap years ahead of everyone in dealing with today's 2 biggest challenges in the frum world.
Hirshel Tzig 2:24, “you heard it here first, folks! abdication of the Belzer throne coming soon.”
ReplyDeleteפון דיין מאהל צי ג-טס אויערן
וואס גייט דיר אהן אז ער בלייבט רבי?
ReplyDeleteHirshel Tzig - הירשל ציג said...
ReplyDeleteוואס גייט דיר אהן אז ער בלייבט רבי?
Didn't you just abdicated him? for me he wasn't and isn't and never will be! a rebbe, but a real פוער פיו whom over 70 זקני ת"ח וצדיקים, מסלתה ומשמנה פון יהדות החרידות האבן מחרים גיווען, ואין רפואה למכתו
Anon
ReplyDelete"'ואין רפואה למכתו
you are a kofer in chazal, the shulchan orech writes in hilchas yom kippur, that there is a way to ask Mechila from a shochen offer, and he followed, dont follow the path of your brothers, who let their Kanuois go to their head
anon 4:55, "you are a kofer in chazal,"
ReplyDeleteTake it easy, he was put in cherim as a kofer! by 70+ זקני ת"ח וצדיקיםthey can abdicate him! he can't forgive himself!
כל הפורש מן המינות מיד מיית - ח"ו
Anon
ReplyDelete"Take it easy, he was put in cherim as a kofer! by 70+ זקני ת"ח וצדיקיםthey can abdicate him! he can't forgive himself! "
can you bring me some halachic sources, trhat a kol koreh has some halachicic value.
I told you a shulchan orech, you answered me with some signed pashkevil.. that was forced upon most of the signators out off the Vodisloiver and the holy Birech Moshe thay was in cherem by the Rebettzin and the Sharmasher.
Is torah dictaing you ? or the yoshvie keronas of Lee cor Ross?
I am no Belzer chosid, but y r u adding Chas Vesholem to the chazal, if it is applicable then let him die, and if not then you are cursing a Odem Beyisroel
anon 7:05, "I am no Belzer chosid,"
ReplyDeletemaybe so but still an idiot.
Dunno, but in the Chaim Berlin yeshiva, especially among Rav Aron Schechter, Rav Yonosom David and Reb Avrom Fruchthandler they hold that "gantz Belz is treif" and that the Belzers are all "GANGSTERS" because of the way Belz caused a huge "hefsed momon" to them when they wanted to build the Chaim Berlin branch in Yerushalayim, to be called "Yeshivas Pachad Yitzchok" and the Belzer Rebbe outfoxed them and got the property for himself to build HIS big shull and thereby forced the Chaim Berliners to scamper to look for a new place to build their place in Har Nof.
ReplyDeleteTo this day, the echt Chaim Berliners have not forgiven the Belzer Rebbe -- even though a couple of them like the Golds and the Biegeleisens hold "dual Belz-Chaim Berlin nationality" -- no matter, the anash Chaim Berliners especially CB president Avrohom Fruschthandler and Rav Yonoson David the PY rosh yeshiva hold Belz and the Belzers in deep contempt and have never forgiven the Belzer Rebbe for his "crimes" against them.
The CB people favor Satmar going back to the days of Rav Yitzchok Hutner's respect for the first Satmar Rebbe, Rav Yoel, and continued by the friendship and admiration that Rav Aron Schechter shows to both the feuding present Satmar brothers Rebbes, Rav Aharon and Rav Zalman Leib Teitelbaum, and treats them both with equal respect.
The Belzer Rebbe is trying to have his cake and eat it too. On the one hand he "makes peace" with the Israeli government bringing a minister to hear his "plea for peace" and on the other hand he makes moves to "make peace" with that part of Satmar he has access to through his wife's sister Rav Aharon Teitelbaum's wife the daughters of the Bnai Brak Viznitzer Rebbe.
One thing is for sure, Rav Zalman Leib Teitelbaum Satmar Rebbe of Williamsburg is still at war with the Belzer Rebbe, as can be heard: מהר"י מסאטמר נגד דברי האדמו"ר מבעלזא"היריבות ארוכת השנים בין חסידות סאטמר ובעלזא נראה
שעולה מדריגה, זאת לאחר דברים שאומר
מסאטמר, שמגיב על דברי האדמו"ר מבעלזא שליט"א. " (ladaat.net) and this can only please the CB crowd that has never made peace with the Belzers for robbing them of the first location where they wanted to build Yeshiva Pachad Yitzchok.
anon 12:32, "Don't sell us a Megale punim Betorah sheloi Kehalocha as a talmid chochem"
ReplyDeleteElaborate please, worst than kook? worst than most rebbes? worst than ponovitz? after all where is his Megale punim ? other than the usual zionishe babel!
anon 1:30, "But of course! first you make the talmid chuchim "ois t"C" & then you have free rein.."
ReplyDeleteAre you implying that the ber בער
is a ת"ח ? for real??
Anon
ReplyDelete"Are you implying that the ber בער
is a ת"ח ? for real??"
Your stupid name calling, dont add anything to an adult discussion,
I dont see why hirshel does not delete, it brings down the level of his blog
Thank goodness the hatemongers and those that live and breathe loshon hora still have a place to come and relive the glory days of the early 80s.
ReplyDeleteA groisser yasher koiach R Hershel for this great service.
You should be gebentched.
DotL 10:11, "Thank goodness the hatemongers and those that live and breathe loshon hora"
ReplyDeleteע"ז כו: המינים ואפיקורסים מורידין ולא מעלין
הרמב"ם
ראה צורך להיות בקיא בעניני עבודה-זרה ואפיקורסות הנהוגים בדורו
anon 9:59, "I dont see why hirshel does not delete, it brings down the level of his blog"
ReplyDeleteYea, I'm asking the same question ?
Hirshel Tzig 2:24, “you heard it here first, folks! abdication of the Belzer throne coming soon.”
ReplyDeleteTHe current belzer is the son of the biligilyer ruv, whom the belzers hated and tortured him with unspeakable acts, so why is he not calling himself ביליגער רב"י and will have peace for the next 40 years.
DotL 10:11, "Thank goodness the hatemongers and those that live and breathe loshon hora"
ReplyDeleteע"ז דף יד
מסכת עבודה זרה דאברהם אבינו ארבע מאה פרקי הויין
The SR said that today not even 4000 פרקים would be enough.
DotL 10:11, "Thank goodness the hatemongers and those that live and breathe loshon hora"
ReplyDeleteAccording to the seforim חניפה is a greater sin then לה"ר and much more people are נכשול by it! So why all this hoopla on לה"ר only! when not even one sefer yet was written on חניפה only! what's behind it??
In the end, there will be only one Ingarische Chassidishe rebbe left:
ReplyDeleteDer Airmonter.
Let's have the details on hoiw thje bulgorayer was tortured.
ReplyDeletego to Machnovke and ask them
ReplyDeleteHey hirshel, you don't want to start sending ur readership away!
ReplyDeleteHey hirshel, you don't want to start sending ur readership away!
ReplyDeletetrue, but I can't be a cesspool either. It's enough we're doing what we do.
One thing at a time, please!
Hirshel tzig: "דער רשע און עוכר ישראל מנשה פולאף"
ReplyDeleteYou are posting a קו"ק קעגן בעלזא from about 30 years ago! I knew most of them if not all, truly בגוז"מ most of where ארזי הלבנון אדירי התורה בעלי תריסין במשנה ובגמרא read it an you will see they write the same thing as this מנשה הגדול says on the video, what a חוצפה from a blogger to call such a person with derogatory names! Don’t you have any shame? I mean אדרבה tell us what did he said anything different than these גדולי עולם didn't say? Is it you can't reach them so you're acting out on their messenger??? And what about לה"ר ? where are all does לה"ר police when we need them why don't they speak up!???
Der Shygetz said...
ReplyDelete“In the end, there will be only one Ingarische Chassidishe rebbe left: Der Airmonter.”
You mean Lipa !?
MF calling a group of Chassidishe Yidden Maskilim and worse, is what makes him deserving of that title. That and other דרשות he gave over the years.
ReplyDeleteAnon 11:23, “Let's have the details on hoiw the bulgorayer was tortured.”
ReplyDeleteFor one, they locked him up in a hospital room where their was a woman/nurse alone inside to proof that he is נחשד , Unfortunately he had to jump out the window, which he did!!
אטו רוכלי נינהו
tzig 11:33, "MF calling a group of Chassidishe Yidden Maskilim"
ReplyDeleteIt's a dirty job but someone has to do it no? I mean after all when this belzer became rebbe he asked his chasidim to start learning ספרי מהר"ל not gemorah and chsidishe seforim, so they can be versed in דרכי השכלה and from there a leap into treif השכלה you can see it in their arguments always and in their publications, Don't you think someone has to call him and 'them' on that!
you know his intentions as to why he told them to learn מהר"ל?
ReplyDeleteAnon 11:23, “Let's have the details on hoiw the bulgorayer was tortured.”
ReplyDeleteThe funny and absurd thing, they called him a mamzer! (although he was a brother from reb Ahorn..) but when the bear became rebbe they wrote on him that he is a בנש"ק !!!
Tzig: "you know his intentions as to why he told them to learn מהר"ל?"
ReplyDeleteOf course I do, Don't you ?
He didn't tell them to learn maharal to be able to understand tanya better.... Cmon!
ReplyDeletethen his "master plan" failed
ReplyDeleteBelzers aren't the most forward thinking bunch
The funny and absurd thing, they called him a mamzer!
ReplyDeleteWho called him a mamzer? Anywhere in writing?
tzig: "you know his intentions as to why he told them to learn מהר"ל?"
ReplyDeleteI mean a יניק of barely 20 years לא קרא ולא שנה anywhere and anything (they trew him out from zelem cheder on bedford ave) is asking to learn his אפרוחים nothing else than ספרי מהר"ל I knew than where he and they are heading!
he had Rebbes, very good ones. Old Belzer Chasidim.
ReplyDeleteanon 12:01, "Who called him a mamzer? Anywhere in writing?'
ReplyDeleteWhy, You don't believe me?
tzig: "then his "master plan" failed Belzers aren't the most forward thinking bunch"
ReplyDeleteA טפּוש learning מהר"ל is worse than before he learned?
ראשית חכמה הוא יראת ה׳
הכתוב אומר, ה׳ יהיב חכמה לחכימא
How's the mood in Belz?
ReplyDeleteNot one Belzer on this blog? It would make sense as they have no interest in anything except Belz.
Tzig: “he had Rebbes, very good ones. Old Belzer Chasidim.”
ReplyDeleteWhen before zelem or after? If they where so good why send him away zelem? (zelem wasn’t up to par does days) And after zelem he was tainted already… BTW he threw out most “Old Belzer Chasidim” when he became rebbe, and the ones he left where like him and like his father…
Ur calling all belzers tipshim? Not forward thinking!!!!
ReplyDeleteThey have more of a future with aron mortches son, who mishpacha mag said is goint to get engaged this year, than lubabs have...
JJJ 12:15, "Not one Belzer on this blog?"
ReplyDeleteand not one satmerer either.
anon 12:19, "They have more of a future ---- than lubabs have...
ReplyDeleteThat's painful, and what's more painful that lubab's don't even know what kind of future they want... והבן כי קצרתי
With all their secular studies and use of "professionals", they are not maskilim in any sense. "Professionals" are used for group control vd"l
ReplyDeletetoiv toireh im derech eretz they are oisek al hamichyu ve'al hakaluleh or they are studying they have feiner dayunim they dont twitter all day like the satmoirim belzer ruv is a bnon shel kdoishim it s just that he plays his cards abit rough most rabunim from the kol koire had major charuteh now that the zally aaron sqaubble is easing a new maaruche is needed
ReplyDelete"and not one satmarer"
ReplyDeletejoke? right?
Who knew that Mahral is a subversive Maskilik work? This is the genious of this blog! Amazing what primtives lurk here.
ReplyDeleteJingle Belz 12:25,"With all their secular studies and use of "professionals", they are not maskilim in any sense."
ReplyDeleteYou don't make from בעלזער יושבים maskilim overnite! But they came a long way..
Anon
ReplyDelete"The SR said that today not even 4000 פרקים would be enough"
he said alot of hype statements, add this to the list
in zalmen guraryes book it is wriiten the most difficult thing in the briyeh is the ibergang for a chosid from a previous rebbe to the successor. hagoo! pregnancy labour and the actual delivery and tzaar gidel harebi hachodosh . oy va'voy az areebbe geit avek bli me'male mkoimoi. belz vet zahn a vinkel etc...
ReplyDeleteanon 12:26, "most rabunim from the kol koire had major charuteh"
ReplyDeleteHow do you know, Did they tell you, do you have it writing? and if you do (from 1 or 2) did anything changed in the facts they write about than? most are dead
אין משיבין אחר הארי המת
...Far toilets in yirishulayim biz mshiach vet kimn
ReplyDelete...Far toilets in yirishulayim biz mshiach vet kimn
ReplyDeleteanon 12:36, "belz vet zahn a vinkel "
ReplyDeleteבעלז וועט זיין אין ווינקל where they belong!
man, Satmars are a jealous lot! what do you have to be jealous about?
ReplyDelete"You don't make from בעלזער יושבים maskilim overnite! But they came a long way."
ReplyDeleteYou can't take ingereseher kep and make them into maskilim. Nisht meglech
anon 12:33, "he said alot of hype statements, add this to the list'
ReplyDeletevery funny, you should make a book of all satmar hype! probably you will wind up re-rinting ALL OF HIS SEFORIM, which to you they will sound all hype!
Anon
ReplyDelete"For one, they locked him up in a hospital room where their was a woman/nurse alone inside to proof that he is נחשד , Unfortunately he had to jump out the window, which he did!!
אטו רוכלי נינהו"
its a lie,its a lie it is a rumor fabricated in Sands street.There is no comunity that has such a powerfull PR lying manufacturing going on.
When he came back from his European visit of Tishre , he was very sick, he went straight to hospital and he was niftar on Cheshvan , he could not move no where.
As a Satmar chosid with a large dirtbag of Rozele, Bier Moshe,Atzie chaim, Reb chaimel of Satmar, etc... I would have a little decencey to bug out of other family rifts.
Not belz
ReplyDeleteBut aron sure would love to send a minyan to zalis kaiver
Not belz
ReplyDeleteBut aron sure would love to send a minyan to zalis kaiver
most of these rabonim have kids and u can ask them or their chasidim
ReplyDeleteits the ershte belzer ruvs vort why make fun of it
ReplyDeleteHirshel: "man, Satmars are a jealous lot! what do you have to be jealous about?"
ReplyDeleteI don't think they are jealous, But rather scared.
ויירא יעקב מאד, יעקב אבינו בהאי פחדא הוה יתיב שמא יגרום החטא
anon 12:45, "most of these rabonim have kids and u can ask them or their chasidim"
ReplyDeleteDid you ? as mentioned the stated reasons they gave in this קו"ק was and is valid so it really doesn't matter what kids say or don't say, maybe their kids will deny what they said, so does it matter? besides:
אין משיבין אחר הארי המת
anon 12:47, "its the ershte belzer ruvs vort why make fun of it"
ReplyDeleteThere is no seforim from him, so IDK what you talking about, besides there are many chsidishe yiden from belz in satmer! maybe not in the vinkel! some where יושבי ראשונה במלכות like ר' ישראל בריעף, יפ"ה פר"מ ז"ל the envy of the chasidishe yiden
anon 12:44. "There is no comunity that has such a powerfull PR lying manufacturing going on."
ReplyDeleteduh.. did you hear of Belz?
maybe thats reason the his'achdes hurabunim is no more a force because to join it meant do as i say and fight my enemy which ruv wants to be part of such an organization.so except sugar lepesach and the well known issur of going to florida it dont mean nothing
ReplyDeleteanon 1pm every chasidus has its slogan chodosh user min hatoireh belonged to the gedoilri ungaren and was hijacked by satmar ,so belz has belz vet zahn etc even lets say it meant der oiven uhn tish in satmar
ReplyDeleteIsn't being a maskil a mayla in chabad theology/mythology?
ReplyDeleteAnonymous 12:28, said...
ReplyDeleteWho knew that Mahral is a subversive Maskilik work? This is the genious of this blog! Amazing what primtives lurk here.”
Just like many chasidishe seforim are philosophical (but not philosophy as we know it) if you know what I mean… the same with the ספרי מהר"ל but in haskala thought! I’ll not elaborate here… and I’ll leave it at that (for now), and let you be the cuchem. Oh, BTW correct your primitive spelling its Genius!
biology, psychology, it's all good.
ReplyDeleteanon 1:07, "maybe thats reason the his'achdes hurabunim is no more a force "
ReplyDeleteSR was against an התאחדות הקהילותhere in America as in Europe! he settled for an התאחדות הרבנים not קהילות so when the rabunim are gone there is no more התאחדות exactly as was intended! of course when a new generation decides it can have a new התאחדות הרבנים "a meeting of minds" , which can still happen when the dust settles.
tzig, "biology, psychology, it's all good.'
ReplyDeleteOr bad, just like דקדוק it was good and than it became badalthough IDK about biology if there is any (torah) good in it.
I was referring to the comment where he called it theology/mythology. Thereby poking fun at terms used in Chabad since Gen1. I just took it a bit further
ReplyDeletepar for the course for these people...
nothing is sacred, even what they claim is
Anon 1:14, “Isn't being a maskil a mayla in chabad”
ReplyDeleteלמיימינים בה - סמא דחיי, למשמאילים בה - סמא דמותא
Is there a psychologue in the house? How are Belzers supposed to deal with this event? After 30 years, seeing the Rebb and disciple being beaten into submission and humiliated.
ReplyDeleteDunno what all the chevre wrote...
ReplyDeleteBut as a proper mainstream belzer and knowing the roov for nearly 40 years, all the ruv needs is his way. He wanted a separate kehile, shchite, moisdes, newspaper, hechsher etc.
All these he wanted because he has a very unique attitude and opinion (kemiven, yesh dorshim lishvach, veyesh dorshim lignay), and he wanted his fingerprints on his oylem. And, if they wanted it too, iz vos ken zeyn besser?
The mechile story doesn't interest him in the least! If he's got all he wanted, vos shtert eym ibeberbeyten?
Men ken nisht avekmachen that he is certainly a very original and unconventional rebbe, and therefore people that don't know him can be very mistaken when they try to analyze him. Ki loy machshevos she'ar rebbes machshevoysov, and lav davke for good. But thats his nature, and it is quiet interesting.
He never molds into the classical frame of thought, be it hachzores shtochim, joining the left in israeli elections, psychology, and multiple other issues.
I have no doubt that he still has some more surprises up his sleeve.
anon 2:20, "all the ruv needs is his way"
ReplyDeleteAnd he is not getting it!
In all true Belz did what they did because there was no other choice! The war on the chareidim is just starting up, segregated buses, sidewalks, elevators, girls schools for sefardim and ashkenasim etc. etc. is just foreplay of what’s really coming!!! Which is Yeshvah Boys will must join the army! (Which is more like a melting pot)!!! And than frum Girls in the army will follow! (which they will ready to die for c”v) Changing the curriculum in the yeshivas and boys schools !!! Learning Hebrew/ivrit and secular studies! etc. etc., all the above are already Laws in the books of Israel, Just weren’t enforced until now! The chareidim will try to fight first, by not excepting any monies to their schools and kolleim, that will make them penniless and will have to rely on handouts from the Diaspora, than by mass protests in land and in the Diaspora!!! But all efforts will not help!? They the Israelis are determent this לקעקע ביצתן של החרידים
This is a scary scenario! But this was always the goal from the Israelis from day one! The only hold back was from the mass protesting from overseas! They feel now One, that the overseas protesting is not as strong and sincere as before hence Satmar rav RYT is gone, and Second they feel that they got a signal from America that the crackdown will be welcome, hence HRD protest recently against segregation in Israel , Although I feel that the Americans are duping them! And want real freedom for the chareidim only in America and denying it to the Israelis! Got it! So
That israel will becaome a farce! Not a Jewish state anymore other than in Name, Therefore a lot of old theories as of why Jews need a state will fall wayside.
Belz and other cheredim know, feel, and fear all these new developments, exactly the plot as Satmar ruv! Warned, and they the frum have no choice (which many others besides belz are doing) But to warm up to Satmar which has some worldwide name recognition political clout and organization with a sense of purpose other than just monetarily! And the Cheridim from the Diaspora as a whole Worldwide will organize monetarily and politically, and be supportive of their damming plight in Israel, That’s what’s really happening behind the scenes.
Anon 2:28
ReplyDeleteIf your storyline is true then Satmar/Extremists are trying to force the issue themselves by stirring up the masses with their crazy behavior.
It's not some kind of Prophecy from RYT, it's an act of desperation.
DotL 3:03, "an act of desperation."
ReplyDeleteThat's how you sound like DoLittle.
anon 2:20, "Men ken nisht avekmachen that he is certainly a very original and unconventional "
ReplyDeleteHis Rome like holy iconic displays in synagogue and eating style supers!
His centralized Hollywood star figure in betted in all his one line statements and arrangements.
His knowledge of Neo Roman architectural eclectic taste with rococo, gothic, and other classical court yards, and styles
Indeed very unconventional but not very original.
Anonymous said...
ReplyDeleteDotL 3:03, "an act of desperation."
That's how you sound like DoLittle.
Just keep your 24 hour vigil here and stay away from the real world.
Thanks
אמת'דיג? דער בעלזער רב האט גע'עצה'ט זיינע חסידים צו לערנען ספרי מהר"ל מפראג? שומו שמים! מ'לייגט נאך תפילין דארט?
ReplyDeleteאין סאקמיר האט דער רבי זי"ע געפאדערט דעם עולם צו לערנען לכבוד פסח גבורות השם פונעם מהר"ל, און די תוצאות האבן נישט געשפעטיגט: היינט פרעסט מען אין סאטמאר בריש גלי די אריזאנא מצות! רח"ל
כידוע פלעגן אלע משכילים פילעווען אין ספרי מהר"ל. דער גולם פון פראג איז געווארן א משכיל ווען ער האט זיך אנגעליינט ביים מהר"ל אין שטוב. און מ'זאגט אז דער גולם'ס אייניקלעך האבן זיך שפעטער געטויפט. איז דען שמד א חידוש אויב ס'איז ספרי מהר"ל נושרין מחיקו????
טראסקעט ארויס אלע ספרי מהר"ל איבער די גאסן פון וויליאמסבורג. טויט פאר השכלה!!!
כ'ל ב'איה ל'א י'שובון!!!!
Berel zol leibn hindret yur!
ReplyDeleteNan in nantik in shpitul
Ain yur shvimn pul
Only satmer can make gramn like this
why is he a רוצח? what did he do to deserve that line?
ReplyDelete(see cartoon)
Anon
ReplyDelete"The only hold back was from the mass protesting from overseas!"
is that a known fact, of DerYid or Der blatt?
Did Ben Gurion write this in his memoirs? or you found this fact his private diary?
Anon
ReplyDelete" He wanted a separate kehile, shchite, moisdes, newspaper, hechsher"
if this was his goal of his life he is a AAA loser.
His newspaper is a failure, never got traction, Hamevaser got traction after a month, what he could not get in 3 decades.
His Hecsher is lower then Yoke/Kenig hechsher,
Hazois Belz asher umarni Betziloi ....???
Anon
ReplyDelete"SR was against an התאחדות הקהילותhere in America as in Europe! he settled for an התאחדות הרבנים not קהילות so when the rabunim are gone there is no more התאחדות exactly as was intended! of course when a new generation decides it can have a new התאחדות הרבנים "a meeting of minds" , which can still happen when the dust settles."
your pilpul is like a Brisker 2 dinim style pilpul, which Satmar Ruv was against,...
It is simple, he did not like Ichud Kehilas where he will not be the Emperpor.. the rest is for Kelblech like you to give a biur
איך בעט נישט בארעדן דער זקן הרבנים הרב מיאקע שליט"א
ReplyDeleteא דאנק
Why not baredn his worthless hechsher? What makes rabbi joker or his hechsher untouchable?
ReplyDeleteווייל אזוי האב איך געזאגט!!!
ReplyDeleteHis label company isn't so busy lately like they used to be, any good reason people don't want to pay an extra dollar for his sticker on twizzlers licorice?
ReplyDeleteOh consumers want an actual hechsher...
מוחה מוחה מוחה
ReplyDeleteאיך
ReplyDeleteYou forgot to make that word BOLD!!!
!!!
Lol
Is he a member of hisachdis?
ReplyDeleteHirshel
ReplyDeleteI, chas vesholem did not talk against the Yoke Ruv, he is a talmid chochem a charif, and a much bigger yiras Shomain then the Nirbarter and his brother the Valover.
But I just stated a fact, that his hashgacha is a failure.
Annon
ReplyDelete"Oh consumers want an actual hechsher..."
Who decides?
Isn't the muzhay older?
ReplyDeleteYour only sacred cow has finally been discovered after all these years of blogging!
ReplyDeleteצענדליגע טויזענטער אידישע קינדער זענען געהאדעוועט געווארען אויף זיינע נאשעריי
ReplyDeleteדרך ארץ
אפשר איז דער מוזשאיער עלטער
I don't think he's the only sacred one. I just didn't like how he got dragged into this conversation for no reason. I happen to know him.
ReplyDeleteThe laws of supply and demand must have finally put his stickers to rest
ReplyDeleteWhy don't you "get to know" the fulop brothers that you so freely besmirch?
ReplyDeleteI besmirched only M Fulop, and not because I took issue with his hechsher...
ReplyDeleteDo you not see the difference???
Hazois Belz asher umarni Betziloi ....???
ReplyDeleteWhy did you ever say something so utterly stupid!
No. Your defence of the yokke was that you know him. Why not get to know menashe fulop? You may be surprised at what and who the man is behind the public rhetoric.
ReplyDeleteI'm not defending him nor do I know him. Just keep the context in focus.
the Yoke Roov doesn't publicly באשמוץ גדולי עולם for hours on end in shuls in front of an Aron Kodesh to hundreds of people
ReplyDeletemenashe Fulop does!!!
יסכר פי דוברי שקר
ReplyDeleteThe letter against some lakewood beis din you had linked would look better if you put in the name braun...
ReplyDeleteI didn't link to it. A commenter did. And Braun didn't open a new Beis Din.
ReplyDeleteNot that I care
שקר
ReplyDeleteWhat lie are you referring to?
Is that verse from todays dose of chitas, which I'm sure you do together with mforshim along with ramabam yaymi
ReplyDeleteFulop's lies
ReplyDeletetoo numerous to mention
Good night
TBC tomorrow IYH
Shwei didn't have a bd without him so its as if he did..
ReplyDeleteיואליש 6:12, -------
ReplyDelete“אין סאקמיר האט דער רבי זי"ע געפאדערט דעם עולם צו לערנען לכבוד פסח גבורות השם פונעם מהר"ל”
True,but only לכבוד פסח for year round he asked to learn: באמ"ח, סש"ש, יושר ד"א, חו"הלבבות, (אוהב ישראל, נו"א ) (ליקוטי מהר"ן , ספר התניא) Also: יחזקאל פרק לד, הוי רועי ישראל אשר היו רועים אותם הלוא הצאן
“כידוע פלעגן אלע משכילים פילעווען אין ספרי מהר"ל”
למיימינים בה - סמא דחיי- למשמאילים בה - סמא דמותא (btw, I would say satmar should learn more ספרי מהר"ל year round) להתרגלם, בדע מה שתשוב!...
“כידוע פלעגן אלע משכילים פילעווען אין ספרי מהר"ל -------- ”
Sarcasm is a form of hidden anger, I wonder what angers you? What’s your agenda? You don’t seem to be a belzer, I only wanted to bring business for the מדפיסי of the ספרי מהר"ל they can focus their sales now on belz.
Put my comments in context and in focus.
דער רמבּ"ם זאגט מקען צייגען אז ממעג - ח"ו - דונען די ע"ז סשטייט דאך אין די תורה: ועבדתם אלהים אחרים
“כ'ל ב'איה ל'א י'שובון” ספרי מהר"ל ?
כל ליצנותא איסורא בר ליצונתא דע״א
Have A Nice Day!
Anon 12:16, “Why don't you "get to know" the fulop brothers that you so freely” besmirch?
ReplyDeleteBecause than he will have to do a mechila job like belz! Ouch it’s to painful!
Hirshel Tzig - 12:13
ReplyDeleteצענדליגע טויזענטער אידישע קינדער זענען געהאדעוועט געווארען אויף זיינע נאשעריי
And millions are געהאדעוועט on ‘OU d’ Cholev akim, and שחיטות from קלים with all kind of היתירים לקולא
DotL 4:08, “Just keep your 24 hour vigil here and stay away from the real world.”
ReplyDeleteכל מה שיאמר לך בעל הבית עשה חוץ מצא
Rav Tuvia Weiss the rav"d of the Eida is physically ill, a lot of colorful things will happen c"v when and if he is gone, the maneuverings started already, this matter is a pre curser of what will come...
ReplyDeleteפירושים יותרים, וד"ב עכשיו
The belzer rebbe is the "moshe" of our dor and is bichezkas moshiach. Based on all that enlightening information that my local lubavitcher chasidim pressed upon everyone to know about in the early Nuns. At that time I was certain it was rav shach, but now that he's gone, it must be the belzer.
ReplyDeleteanon 11:21, "The belzer rebbe is the "moshe" of our dor and is bichezkas moshiach"
ReplyDeleteOh no not another one! משיח בן יוסף? or משיח בן דוד ?
Seems as you don't want moshiach at all.
ReplyDeleteShame on you.
AnoTrue,but only לכבוד פסח for year round he asked to learn: באמ"ח, סש"ש, יושר ד"א, חו"הלבבות, (אוהב ישראל, נו"א ) (ליקוטי מהר"ן , ספר התניא) Also: יחזקאל פרק לד, הוי רועי ישראל אשר היו רועים אותם הלוא הצאן "
ReplyDeleteWhat a white Lie, he never said only pesach..
Stop already
Do u have a letter from the Satmar Ruv stating which seforim, its all Nussen Yossef a pathalogical liar even in the Satmar world, and from mthere to Gelbmans fabrications
check out his statements on Mechel Lebowitz, ask any Sands street talmid.. on Nusen Yossefs lies
n
"
I don't know if it hit monsey yet, but here in lakewood the belzers television station mailed out a great big magazine with one of the most revolting pictures I have ever seen and certainly an image I would NOT want my children to see. Gangster looking guy with tattoos, a gotee, earings and tefilin!!!! Almost as bad as aish, maybe worse! I am moche kol hatokef. (Will send it in time permitting)
ReplyDeleteYou are correct,
ReplyDeletethis hidabroot pamphlet is very reckless...over the cliff..
sorry but there wasn`t one normal comment on this blog
ReplyDeleteand you sure didn't help the situation with your comment...
ReplyDeleteBelz needs to ask מחילה from dayan gabad r y weiss זצל who was persolloly terrorized עד למאד.
ReplyDeleteAnon 3:27, "sorry but there wasn`t one normal comment on this blog"
ReplyDeleteYou read all of them? and you thing you're normal? don't panic you're in the right place.
Tziki
ReplyDelete"Belz needs to ask מחילה from dayan gabad r y weiss זצל who was persolloly terrorized עד למאד."
whoever knew the real Rav Wiess, would know that his real terrorists were from within
Please tell us anOn , 11 years rav weiss sat in שלום until kaftso rugzo shel belz ,who else was against him?
ReplyDeletethis ignorant savage,this piece of human garbage,is not only criminaly insane,but as it's well known in Williamsburg,he is a known pervert,in other words he is the perfect represantative of Satmar.
ReplyDeleteTziki Kedareh
ReplyDeleteRav Wiess was no terrorist and no Kanoi whatsoever, he made peace with Belz, till the hooligans of Willi to back off, so dont get him in this picture.
He was the most anti Kanoi ruv, you could find.
anon 8:24, "this ignorant savage" "he is a known pervert"
ReplyDeleteאץ קוצץ. בן קוצץ
פץ לא זו הדרך. כנחש עלי דרך. שלח יד בחמוקי ירך
המעמך תשלמנה כי ממאסת כי אתה תבחר ולא אני???