tattered book and toothache, Slonim
That's right. Some of you people have no class. All you can talk about when watching the heartbreaking hesped is whether or not he's Chabad, she was Chabad, were the kids Chabad. It's classless voyeurism, if you ask me. Not the video, but the dissecting of the family here. If YGB thinks that there's was anything but awe and respect and yes, bittul for the Rebbe when it came to his aunt, then he's a fool. I'm sorry to be offensive to him, we see other in the supermarket and he waives hello, so I hope I don't lose that when he reads this here. I think most of you would agree with me that a Rebbishe eynikel like her would not just forget about her roots just because her husband joined Lubavitch after they were married. Not that wasn't a Lubavitcher beforehand, but it wasn't all the way, he was learning by Reb Dovid in Brisk-Yerushalayim, not in Lubavitch. And I think we could all agree that even the Lubavitcher Rebbe was very supportive of the fact that she remembered and cultivated those roots and taught here children about their great zeides. What I don't fully understand is how the Slonimer Rebbe's son took a Litvak like that for a SIL when he could've had the best Slonimer bocher instead. But here I am, prying a bit and digging into their personal lives as well...
What we do need to know is her strong will, her countless acts of chesed, the fact that so many people cried like children when hearing of her passing - as if they lost a parent of their own. And a parent who could not say goodbye to because of her sudden passing. At a time like that you never forgive yourself for not giving a woman of her stature the respect she deserved. When she mussered you it was accepted with love, most likely because it was meant with love, for no ulterior motives. It wasn't because it made her look bad or anything like that. It would be most appropriate to focus on her attributes, not her loyalties, especially at a time like this. We can see that this is a terrible loss from the fact that her husband Reb Ezra, despite his gruff appearance and tough mannerism, now seems like a plag gufo again without his life's partner. As a husband you cry along with him because you know how at a loss you would be, chas vesholom... May the eibershter comfort all of her family and may they know only simcha and good news from here on in.
94 comments:
Hirshel.
From which Slonoimer rebbe is she a Einikel?
Her maiden name was Wienberg? since there are a lot of misnagdim in the Wienberg family as the Aish founder and Baltimore Rosh
her zeide was Reb Avrohom Wineberg of Tverya/Yerushalayim, who passed away in 5741.
בעל "ברכת אברהם" זצ"ל
Hirshel,
So she was a niece of Reb Sholem Noach and a first cousin for the Rebbe of Benai Berak,
Thanks
"What I don't fully understand is how the Slonimer Rebbe's son took a Litvak like that for a SIL when he could've had the best Slonimer bocher instead"
Well there is the statement from the amshinaver after taking a Brisker for a SIL "es iz gringer tzu machen a Lamden biz a chusid vee tzu machen a Chassid biz a Lamden"
you forget that the Amshinover took him in Shanghai, IIRC.
Tzig,I don't know what you want from people.
Unless you,as usual, are trying to kiss up and "prove" Lubavitch credentials.
What was "crass"??That people have a natural curiosity about the family?
And what exactly do you want from R'Bechoffer? With his one post saying the rebbetzen as an aynekel, felt part of Slonim?
Grow up.Really.You make it sound like you knew the Rebbitzen or her husband, while the emes is you did not.Stop with the act.
shea
you don't me or whom I know, so stop with the amateur psychobabble.
gut gezugt but still a good line
Accusing YGB of being a fool is a low blow.You would need to live a few lifetimes to reach his accomplishments
What else is new in the Circus
You never learned in R'Ezras yeshiva and he has lived in LA probably before you were born, so don't claim you knew him or her, and don't even try and prove that you are more mishpucheh than his own plimenik.So falsh, such an act.Let's keep it real,ok?
as someone whose two sisters had Reb. Shochet as a teacher in Beis Yaakov L.A. I can tell you that she would tell the girls "don`t worry i am not Lubavitch"
Also i once spoke at a kinnus talmidim after pesach when the Ohr Elchanan Beis Hamedresh aka "zal" was still in a trailer. I said over a Reb Chaim on hilchos chumetz umatzah. Reb Ezra Shlita jumped on me with a bavvusteh Reb Shlomo and Reb Reuven on the Sugya. He was impresive to the 16 year young boy that i was. Since that time i either prepare rather well or keep my mouth closed
shea
bitte hakt nisht kein tshaynik
I think that at a certain point something will have to be written about how a (almost) whole brilliant family got sucked into Lubavitch and could not get out of their connection when Lubavitch started to go downhill.They are nebach stuck there.R'Immanuels great talent is wasted and R'Ezra, who could have been a leading voice and light in the Yeshiva World is stuck trying to say shiur to low level Chabad teenagers and trying to combat the meshichist craze.What a waste, he is a great man and his rebbitzen was a tzenua and tzidkonis.Two of my sisters were her students in Bais Yaakov
HT,
I heard that when they got married the issue was the shtreimel. Her Zaide was Rebbe at the time, and they somehow worked it out. At that time, his lubab creds were pretty open and yet they took him as a SIL.
Sadly, today such things just dont' happen.
Anon
"Accusing YGB of being a fool is a low blow"
I read on a blog his writings on Philosophy, Kabala and Chassidus, he is a big fat idiot over their too, he probably knows the 19 letters of RSR Hirsch good, but he dabbles in fields he has no deep knowledge.
Tzig,
I think you overshot here. I didn’t see anything disrespectful written about either the departed or her spouse. The ‘speculation’ as you call it was mild and innocuous. Actually, the entire tread (and lately much of the blog) was free of the usual Snag/Lubavitch fighting.
Tzig the initial comments don't seem all that bad . . .
Anon at Wednesday, March 03, 2010 3:08:00 PM
thank you,thank you. yg brechhoffer, is worse than a fool, he's a master at twisting divrei chazal,chasidus,and other area of which he professes absolute cluelessness, to fit his twisted hashkafa. if only the baal habtim knew to stay away from his shtusim. as I heard from echad min hagodolim, the reason there apikorses is echad shogeg, echad meizid, is because they had no right being nichnas lichakira, and even a usually fool should know his limits. brechhoffer is the quintessential example of "a little knowledge can be dangerous." and he's a gezunte baal gaiva to boot. feh.
Am I wrong that you wrote in a blogpost some months (or maybe a year ago) that there are no hesped at a levaye of a Lubavither?
no, Richard, you're not wrong
Even Mottel the most partisan Chabad fellow did not see anything wrong.
I guess Tzig is just proving his "hiskashres"
What a way to live a life, always having to prove yourself
Richard said...
Am I wrong that you wrote in a blogpost some months (or maybe a year ago) that there are no hesped at a levaye of a Lubavither?
Wednesday, March 03, 2010 4:04:00 PM
Richard, I was at the levaya and in his 40 minute speech he barely talked about her. Listen carefully and you see that is wasn't a hesped, it was more of a call to action on various issues, students, her family, community.
Hirshel
I really am somewhat puzzled at your amazement that there are achzorim out there that would resort to divisiveness and hate at such a tragic moment.Even when you post something not even remotely connected to Lubavitch they come crawling out of the woodwork and turn it into some sort of taineh against Lubavitch.Did you really think that a post about a Chabadsker RY would go by without some jerk coming up with some narishe taineh?
The "geoines" RL shown by the vantz who has a problem with "ad mosai" is simply amazing.He obviously has no idea what he's saying three times a day when he recites "Es Tzemch....".Being a "snag" he is probably completely unaware of the many stories of the heiliger berdichiver,The Minchas Elozer and many other Gedilim including the Chofeitz Chaim who had "taines" against the Ribono Shel Oilom.This vister am hooretz vaist nisht ah possuk Chumash when Moishe Rabeinu stuck his neck on the line for Klall Yisroel with "taines" to the RSO.An och in vei tzu zeir frumkeit and "tzidkus"
Zev
What is happening here that so many Talmidie Chachomim are "stuck" in Lubavich? can we create a organization to save these poor souls, we will promise them all Shteles in the Ponivizh? its anyway splintered, lets have another few shiurim there that are only staged for Utube? and instead of fighting the Meshichist Crazies, they will fight the Shachist as Markowits and his ilk..
and then we will print a Chidushie Reb Ezra and a Chidushie Reb Emanuel with the black tall cover with the traditional Rashi Oisies, and the league of gedolim will be enlarged,it will be mamesh gevaldig.
Anonymous 7:15
Don't worry about talmidei chachomim "stuck" in Lubavitch because there are very few of them.Some have quietly lowered profile and one fellow who had a very close relationship with the Rebbe and Chabad and learned in Telz will not send his kids there.
So you can calm down
Anon 3
The misnagdim lately are davening very long the tefilas Amida, what exactly are they thinking by a 15 minute Shemonie Esra,I like the ones that are wobbling and do their nails at the same time, have you ever seen one of those?
Since Lubavitch started going downhill there have been very men or boys of any caliber who have joined.Years ago Lubavitch was seen as warmer than the Litvishe yeshivas, less narrow minded than the Chasidishe yeshivas.Also there was also a good chance to get a "shtelleh" in a Lubavitch yeshiva for good second tier bochurim who would not have gotten it in Ooilem Hayeshivos.
But that was then.Today they are sending the boys on "shlichus" to all kinds of farvorfeneh places where a bochur cannot do any serious learning.Serious learning is not only getting semicha,I mean serious beiyun learning to bring out Rabbonim,roshei yeshiva of real caliber.When a bochur has to leave yeshiva at twenty to roam the world on shlichus with very shvacheh elements is is almost impossible.R'Ezra Schochat tries his best with his bochurim, but he is getting them from your average Lubavitch non toradigeh backround where knowing Sha"s in not on the radar.\
Isser Zalman Weissberg now in Toronto, married into the Shochats, had a pipe dream and website of opening a high level yeshiva lemutzuyonim in Lakewood.Tzum sof ess hot zech aroys gelost a boydem, he could not get any boys looking for a heavy duty learning yeshiva
ZEV
you made my day that at least 1 family is saved, lets pray for the rest
Anon
Don't worry the Rebbe saves everybody.
P.S It's already bain hazemanim in Oholei Tora?
Zev and Anon 7:37, u guys r sick. B"H in chabad yeshivas today there are plenty of bochurim who can hold their own against any litvishe bochur. B"H we don't make a centerfolds of them like others. We don't put pricetags on their necks like if u want a SIL shtayger pay $$$$ buy him a new car, house etc.
Every day I thank Hashem for giving me two sons who B"H learn day and night and bec of the chinuch they received in the Rebbe's moisdos are yirei shamayim, know what real ahavas yisroel is, and the main thing don't ever walk around with their noses in the air looking down at a fellow yid.
Zev
Its already Bein Hazmanim in Mir and Ponovizh too. Lets pray the Rebbe will save them too.
"An och in vei tzu zeir frumkeit and tzidkus"
I forgot to say "lomdus" to.
"Don't worry about talmidei chachomim "stuck" in Lubavitch because there are very few of them"
The guys posting this kind of unsubstantiated d..k are of course "talmedai chachomim" of the highest caliber, but all is not black .I work with a number of yeshiveshe guys who are all talmedai chachomim and we get along famously without invective or any recriminations against Lubavitch and all it entails.In fact one of the is an einikel of RYK.
The low level of learning in Lubavitch , you could claim, is not inherent to todays Lubavitch theology (I actually think it is).The reason the yeshovos and the rabbonim are not on the level of other krayzen is the simple fact that kolelim, the place were a yungerman can grow are almost non existent in Lubavitch.Even the famous kolel in 770 is a program of a year, this is not serious in depth for years study.While Chabad claim that today with high levels of assimilation one cannot close themselves in kolel for ten years like in Lakewood.Ok.Nu, let's accept that for the sake of argument, however even Mordechai lost his level when he was osek bezorchei zibbur.You cannot have first class talmidei chachmim when yungerlait are4 sent on shlichus at 25.Now, of course you could say that the frum oilem will have a partnership.Lubavitch will focus mainly on outreach and for arguments sake,Lakewood will focus on learning so am yisroel will have who to look up to for scholarship and who to send out for outreach.The "broch" is that Lubavitcher have an aynreddenisch that they don't need to learn, they know enough,they parrot some Ramba"m and Sichos and are yotsei, and their kids follow this .When such a bochur ends up by The Rosh in Ohr Elchonon there is a very small chance that the Rosh will get him to become a scholar of real caliber,kol shekain the other very mediocre Lubavitcher yeshivos
Anon3
They get on with you well because after all you learned in Ponovizh and your uncle was good friendS with RYK.I"m also sure that it's only on the net that you release steam, because in real life you are a nice guy
To Anon3
I am really puzzled at your amazement that there are achzorim out there that would resort to (divisiveness and hate)complaining and challenging HASHEM at such a tragic moment.there is not a yid in the world who dares to challenge Hashem in public but this non believer had to do it at his wife's funeral instead of thanking Hashem in public for giving them beautiful 45 years together
I saw his remarks on COL complaining on Hashem that she did not deserve to die" בעלה ספד לה
אנחנו לא יודעים למה זה קרה האסון. אשתי נתנה מעל ל-42 משנות חייה לזולת",: Since the lubabs were coached into chanting AD MOOSAI against Hashems Gezirus Hagules it pretty much took over their whole Amuna not to be Matzdik as Hadin on any Gezira that befalls them, its one thing to be mispalel and beseech in private to hashem but Taines in public against Hashem instead giving chizik in amina this is ubheard of, its about time they should start joining klal yisroel with repeating the 13 Ani Mamins after davening instead of spitting on their coreligionist
Avrumy: "Even Mottel the most partisan Chabad fellow did not see anything wrong." What does that mean? How am I the most partisan Chabad fellow.
Concerning the nifteres: Here affiliation and allegiances are non-issue here. She was very vocal about her beliefs and opinions, anyone who ate at her Shabbos table knows them. The bottom line: She had amazing mesiras nefesh for the Rebbe and her husband's shlichus. She followed him to the farthest place possible from the Israel of her youth, and lived to her dieing day helping others and raising a chissideshe family in Golus, California. Halavai we'd be so ibbergegeben tzum rebbe'n!
Regarding learning, Lubavitch and the Rosh. I've heard the Rosh say many times that Lubavitcher bochurim are able to shteig in nigle as much if not more then other yeshivos, despite [and I don't recall if he said, but b'pashtus because of] the time spent learning Chassidus and mivtzoyim. I can tell you all the the slander in here would not pass in front of him, and is hepach kavod hames. A bissel derech eretz people!
I like the comment of the fellow who called me a "big fat idiot." He obviously knows me, as I am indeed fat - but let it be said to my credit that I just lost 45 lbs.! Oh-oh, now someone will point to that as proof of my being a ba'al gaivah!
HT, next time you see me, in TT or in the supermarket, I expect an apology. I made a factual comment, no more no less, with no ulterior motive. Good heavens! How can anyone assume that at a time like this I would be that crass, c"v?!
Anyway, HT, Uncle Ezra was Lubavitch through and through when in Brisk, and before. The famous half-beard incident occurred in Ner Yisroel, where the Mashgiach wanted him thrown out because he was constantly going to farbrengen. R' Ruderman would not allow that. He went to Litvishe yeshivos because my grandfather compelled him to do so.
At Brisk, there was a bochur who became Lubavitch when Uncle Ezra was there. R' Berel wanted his brother R' Dovid to throw him out, but R' Dovid refused.
As to the shidduch, being a mumcheh in Chassidic history you'll know better than me, but IIRC there was some hiskashrus in Lita between Lubavitch and Slonim. I don't know if this fact is related, but there is, of course, a prominent Chabad family named Slonim.
In the final analysis, HT, you have lapsed into your error, based on a common Chabad persecution complex, that any comment that can be construed as anti-Chabad is anti-Chabad. A pity. I thought we had gotten beyond that point.
One time my Uncle Elisha took me to a farbrengen, and I participated in the Kos shel Brocho "toast." The Rebbe took an inordinately long look at me (my uncle remarked on it). I think that should entitle me to certain privileges here. :-)
Weissberg is an eydem by Shochet? Givureners marry each other?
Lubab said "Who said Ani Mamin? but I would rather rely on a Goan Olem as Rav Shochet then a on an am horetz"
Klal YIsroel are repeating daily the ani Mamins that the Rambam has formulated, it helps us not to stray away from amuna peshuta if you are going to do the same you might Not complain against Heshem in Public like the Lubabs are doing today
attacking me wont change things
i am trying to mekarev lubavitch to yiddishkeit but you have to drop the Avoide Zura first
good Night
D rek
R ants
I nsinuations
V erbiage
E nemas
L eitzonis
YGB, as the Rebbe once remarked, by unz is sherayim mechayev
Mottel- You should be proud to be called partisan Chabad. Wasn't there a chossid that the Rebbe would call "my partisan"
Ani Mamin
Stop your holier then thou attitude.Do you really think that you could or would act differently if you were faced with the same tragedy c"v?
Apparently your "Ani mamin" is only in yourself.You have a lot to answer for and you should be mispallel that you never be placed in the same situation c"v.
Stop your bigoted and narrow minded posturing.You are nothing more then a ongliblozine gasis haruachnik and if you have any sense of humanity and poshite mentshlichkeit left in you,tu ah bissel mer in the fifte Shulchon Oruch. Keep your mouth shut and du teshuva.
Hirshel
Is it really necessary to print this lunatics ravings?
Amazing composure by a person in obvious pain. Amazing leadership by someone in the midst of a personal churban. "eloykim hashofet kol ho'oretz lo ya'ase mishpot"
can i humbly suggest, let us all think how the nifteres would like us to behave and treat eachother with respect and dignity, and put all the childish squabbles to the side.
-Zev: You obviously know very little about kolel in Crown Heights (for the record, it isn't in 770). People sit and learn b'hasmadah v'shkidah - many individuals stay for far longer then a year . . . Come by and I'll introduce you to the Rosh Kolel - he's another Brisker chapped by Lubavitch.
But L'gufo shel inyan sitting in kolel - mah b'kach? The idea of sitting and kvetching a bankel for 10+ years is an innovation after the war. In the heim who got even a yeshivah education besides the elite? Yet somehow I don't see Lakewood producing greater illuim today. . .
-YGB: The half beard took place when the bochurim felt he was chutzpah'dik to the Rosh Yeshivah.
Was the bochur in Brisk R' Heller? In Baltimore the Rosh was influential on several younger bochurim to come to Lubavitch as well.
To those somehow amazed that Lubavitch would attract the Schochets - don't forget that rabbi Hodokav was their uncle.
Ani (loi) Mamin
as you all can see that you an arrogant Am Haoretz doesn't accept no sources in yiddisghkiet that will stop your Kitrug, it is the real Daal Gieh, a baal haboas hepech daas torah gets up and his mevaze a godal hador,
regarding the constant Lubavicher crying for the geula in every tefila,I would like to remark with a midrash that hashem is saying the difference between the jew and the goi, that whenever they daven it always includes tefila for Binyan Hamikdash, and the Goi davens for his property his materialistic stuff, its basically that the real Jew is foremost crying for moshiach constantly, and is crying Ad Mosai Uzcho Bashvi(tachnun) Ad Mosai Yechoraif Tzoir (theilim),yes he screams ad mosai ad mosai that its late for the geula Kolu Kol Hakitzin(chazal), it seems that our am haoretz has alot of Goyishkiet in himself that he cant even digest the constant holy cry of a other jew that is crying for the Geula day and night,
Zev
all the magidei shiur in Lubavich know as much torah as the biggest rosh yeshiva in the largest yeshivah on earth, Vedal
even with the 1 year kolel system.
YGB,
You are a class act! Indeed Hershel owes you an apology,he somehow managed to turn an obituary and hesped on your aunt the rebbitzen z'l into a discussion about you.
Btw, when you said that someone became Lubavitch while the Rosh was in Brisk:I heard from a relative of Rabbi Heller that he was a chavrusa of your uncle and became Chabad, of course this may not be true and just someone putting Rabbi Heller a longtime Brisker talmid and your uncle together because eventually both became totally involved with Lubavitch.
Btw,I love listening to your shiurim on line
Someone wrote here:there is not a yid in the world who dares to challenge Hashem in public". Well my Rabbi did it in his Dvar Torah before Yiskor on Yom Kippur. He challenged Him about all those innocent children, women and men whom He allows to be killed in terror attacks.
Richard your rabbi did not behave like a jew should behave, go to a different rabbi
this thread is a disgrace
"all the magidei shiur in Lubavich know as much torah as the biggest rosh yeshiva in the largest yeshivah on earth, Vedal"
An example of silliness
Anon
Silliness you have to answer with silliness ONLY
Gedalye,
Hirshel has noting what to apologize for Rabbi YGB, he as an offical person shouldn"t have blog a politicized comment on his cousin /aunt.
"he as an offical person shouldn"t have blog a politicized comment on his cousin /aunt.'
What is an "official person"?
Can YGB not comment on this blog?Why?What was "policiticized" about what he said?
Only anonymous bochurim like you,eh?
Hungarians don't seem to be very smart.
Oh well......
The kids at Oholei Torah are out once again!
its simple! anyone that follows the official party line can comment here, but only if he tears down any any opposing remark and has to use dirty language
Gedalye
if you don"t see in the words How much slonim she was, and how much brisk he he is, then their is not much to argue, you are talking about a woman of valor of 42 years of sacrifice for Klal Yisroel thats all YGB has to offer.He made a mistake and let him cough it up.
So basically, the most streneous exhortations of a man who had just lost his wife of 44 years and in obvious pain and distress to love one another, to show achdus, turns into this farce.
Jews, Yidden - wake up!! The goyim dont care if you came from Lita or Maramuresh or Nevel. And more importantly, neither does God. So why do we? Does it have to take another holocaust when we are all in the camps together to realize how stupid and trivial these issues everyone seems to have with this other types of Jews are.
WAKE UP!!!!!
Mottel said...
YGB said...
-YGB: The half beard took place when the bochurim felt he was chutzpah'dik to the Rosh Yeshivah.
Was the bochur in Brisk R' Heller?
Actually the beard incident was instigated by one of the RY @ NY after REBS wrote a letter to the Rebbe regarding not shaving. The Rebbe wrote him back to show his RY several tshuvos regarding beards quoting some litvishe gedolim. After he did this, this RY a"h instigated some bochurim to attack him and shave half his beard.
YGB, this story involves your grandfather, RDYS a"h. RYH learning in brisk, today rosh kollel in CH, was exchanging letters with your uncle abt chabad shita, chassidus, etc. Your zaide was in BB @ your uncles apt and he found some of these letters. Without saying anything, he gave them to the Rebbe. A while later, your uncle gets a letter from the Rebbe with he'oros on his letters. He realized what happened and told his father ha'yitochon u can send the Rebbe letters that I didn't properly make hachonos (mikva, gartel) to send. His father said that I was only trying to give the Rebbe some nachas from you. REBS told me this is the only time he ever argued with his father. These letters were a major part of RYH becoming a chossid.
I heard the half-beard story from my brother, who heard it from R' Ruderman. R' Ruderman also told my brother that one of the fellows who participated in the incident died young, and that he (R' Ruderman) held it was an onesh for the avlah he perpetrated on Uncle Ezra.
anon: thabks for the clarification. The version I heard about the beard was from Rabbi Brusowankin, of rhe bachurim to become chabad in part b/c of the rosh...
to Annon 2:23
I heard the story about the letter from the Rosh many times. He also added that his fathter got the letters back and a response from the Rebbe T"CH T"CH T"CH. Later when he had more letter the Rosh sent them in as well. He said he never received the second batch of letters back or any response. He took a horah that whne you do something to give the Rebbe nachas, like his father did, you get the letters back and a T"CH. However he just wanted a T"CH so he didnt the letters back or a T"CH.
Is picking out one's beard better than shaving?
so satmer wasnt the first to Flick out a chabadskers beard ?
whom else did they instigate to being Flicked?
"Rabbi Brusowankin"
I'd change my wankin name first
-Anon: I'd change my name if I were you . . . oh wait you don't even have one! Get a life.
YGB said...
I heard the half-beard story from my brother, who heard it from R' Ruderman. R' Ruderman also told my brother that one of the fellows who participated in the incident died young, and that he (R' Ruderman) held it was an onesh for the avlah he perpetrated on Uncle Ezra.
The way I heard the story it wasn't R' Ruderman who instigated it. REBS showed the letter to a younger RY who shall remain nameless and he instigated the attack. I guess RR felt an achrayus as the head of the institution and took it personally as his fault.
4 Year YOEC Alum said...
Actually the Rebbe wrote him a response that he never received. A couple yrs ago someone printed a kuntres with some igros and REBS realized that one of them is an answer to his letter. This jerk who had some access in mazkirus stole the letter and never mailed it. B"H a short time later RLG & RBK realized what's going on and bumped him out.
Hirshel,
I think you do owe an apology to RYGB. I re-read the comment he wrote and think it was acceptable and reasonable (unlike the hate that came after it from others and probably touched an emotional nerve).
PS. Cutting also occurred in Chabad. Find out the story of R' Yosef Braun's Peyos (he is the Rabbi of Tzemach Tzedek Shule in Sydney). The only thing I can say people who can't tolerate somebody's facial hair, is not printable.
funny how lubavitch attracted alot of top bochrim from telz,gateshead,brisk,satmar,& other chassidishe & misnagdisher yeshivahs.you dont see it happening the other way.ever asked yourself why?the answer is obvious.
Anonymous said...
funny how lubavitch attracted alot of top bochrim from telz,gateshead,brisk,satmar,& other chassidishe & misnagdisher yeshivahs.you dont see it happening the other way.ever asked yourself why?the answer is: YOOGATO MOTZOSU TAMIN the others are not missionaries
Yes. The answer is obvious, Who would try to chap your shvachenr kep? But let's call a spade a spade, it has been a long time since Lubavitch chapped a good bochur. 40 years ago they were getting top bochurim, 25 years ago it was regular bochurim. over the last 25 years it is yesomim and bochurim looking to get in on the action of the Lubavitcher scenery (usually in a balcony above the shul), vamavin yavin.
"40 years ago they were getting top bochurim, 25 years ago it was regular bochurim. over the last 25 years it is yesomim and bochurim looking to get in on the action of the Lubavitcher scenery (usually in a balcony above the shul), vamavin yavin."
No!!!!Hamavin LO yovin.Do you actually believe the baloney you spout?For awhile you had me fooled.I thought here is a "snag" that has some seichel.A "snag" that perhaps has not swallowed the usual snag anti Lubavitch propoganda hook,line and stinker (misspell intended).I was wrong.Du krichst of gleiche vent.Your really scraping the bottom of the barrel especially with the "balcony" bit.Feh!!!!!.
I always have said that we have a lot to make up for but damn it so does everybody else.If thats the best you can do you have disappointed me sorely,not that it makes one iota of difference to you.
What is with this "chapt a bochur" phrase. It sounds like someone was kidnapped against their will.
Surely it is easily understood that Chabad attracted people because they had a holy, learned and charismatic Rebbe, chassidus chabad and a certain warmth that was often missing elsewhere.
These days, the most important aspect, the LR himself, is in עולם האמת and surely it is logical that less frum people would be attracted. A by product of this reality is the spread of חבקוק style yidden, who are still attracted to Chassidus Chabad, but couple it with Messianic Zionism (רב קוק), Breslav Simcha/Chassidus, and a touch of Carlebach. They are the ones with the huge knitted kippot and long payes. I know some who wear Kapotes on Shabbos.
All seems normal to me.
Snagville
You said ""40 years ago they were getting top bochurim, 25 years ago it was regular bochurim. over the last 25 years it is yesomim and bochurim..." Your not being very original.Over 50 years ago,before the meshichistin,before shlichus was on the map, I remember that the very same insults (except for your "chochma" about the "balcony" in 770 which clearly reveals you as being a pervert) hurled at Lubavitch on a daily basis.
For originality you should have have stated the following "facts".
Chabad houses are really a front for houses of ill repute.We are really devil worshipers who also worship Ishtar the Babylonian goddess of fertility and the Egyptian gods Isis and Amon Ra to add a little spice to our daily prayer.On Mondays and Thursdays we all go to 770 to get spiritual uplifting from the Dalai Lama.
(The truth of the matter is I haven't davened downstairs in 770 for years because of the shenanigans going on there).
Come on.A "smart guy" like you can come up with some much more and original twiisted and perverted verbiage then I can.
Neh, even yesomim don't come to chabad anymore.
as someone who was ingrained since childhood to have my blood boil when someone even slightly criticized chabad or the rebbe, the comments to this post made me aware that it did not bother me one bit when at the Holtzbergs H'yd levaya R,Ashkenazy and other maspidim talked in public against the ways of hashem yisborech,listening to the rosh/LA i now realize not only the azes to speak out against hakodesh burech hu but the silliness of his statement because she served the public she should not have died. we became immune to talk against H"BH while in the same time we make sure when a friend makes a negative remark about us first we look around if the listeners are only from unzere ,and wow for that person who wasnt carful not to speakin public devurim shein megalin ala letsnein,
doesn't H"KBH deserve something more then we reserve for ourselves ? I decided that in my presence i will not let anyone get away with the ad musai nonsense, i will openly request from the speaker to praise ha"KBH for every thing he does.
Thats the way I heard it from the Rosh on more than one occasion. I dont know about the other details.
Eye opener,
So you have a problem with the Rosh saying that "kesheim shemevorchin al hatovo kach mevorchin al horo'oh"? did you even listen to the whole hesped?
to my friendly anon:
i have a problem with you distorting my words , i said what i said not more and not less ,lets change our ways and always praise hashem and never complain on HIM, as mommy was trained in kindergarten
chabad feels wronged by HKB"H for taking the Rebbe away from them. It's time they need to move on, and stop living by a doctrine to blame HKB"H for everything they don't like.
eye opener:
I don't believe you are a lubavitcher!
1)I heard the levaya, and like every lubavitcher I cringed when Rabbi Rosenberg spoke like that (it was NOT horav ashkenazi, I heard him and remember it was only Rosenberg I don't believe any rov would ever speak that way)but ein odom nitpas b'sha'as tza'aro and it was NOT kefiro though we don't speak that way.
2) My Rosh yeshiva said . we dont understand the ways of the aybershter, when he takes away etc." such talk is traditional talk of yidden and tzdikim thru the generations and much milder than moshe rabeinu';s lomo hareioso
3) I am not sure what ad mosay you are calling nonsense but the encouragemnt tzu MONEN moshiach'n like the chofetz chayim used to was taught to us by our rebbe
if u are another one of those to whom it means nothing, gay vaiter, i dont want to waste words on you. but if u were ingrained to have your blood boil (who ever was ingrained that wya? it was a natuiral reaction of many begining with r' shmuel munkes, many other gedolim v'tovim reacted otherwise but i never heard not do i believe anyone ever ingrained his children or talmidim to react that way in word or by example
To all who bring a raiya from Moshe Rabinu saying Lomu Haroiysu be aware:
Hashem told moshe rabenu to record this private remark in the the torah to teach us that even moshe rabeinu was punished for talking like this even in private,so from here is a Raiya punkt farkert
"Apikurses" in the Gemara:
Rabbi Abbahu said: Were it not explicitly written, "Let Me alone that I may destroy them," it would be impossible to say such a thing: this indicates that Moses took hold of G-d like a man who seizes his fellow by his garment, and said to Him: "Master of the Universe! I will not let You go until You forgive and pardon them."
(Talmud, Brachot 32a)
To see how a real Jewish leader responds to Galus see Below:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=osdyhs0RMLE
The only possible reaction: Ad Mosai
http://www.chabad.org/blogs/blog_cdo/aid/984883/jewish/Ker-A-Velt.htm
Eye opener,
loy kol horoitze litoil es hashem "snag" yitoil. Snagville already gave his unqualified haskomo on the hesped, and "kedai reb snagville lismoich olov bish'as hadchack".
OlyJew said..."Apikurses in the Gemara'""
if you to make a point from the gemura dont scorn that Shas like you do to a fellow blogger, but your point is non sense You quote ( Brachos 32a) Rabbi Abbahu said: Were it not explicitly written, "Let Me alone that I may destroy them," it would be impossible to say such a thing: this indicates that Moses took hold of G-d like a man who seizes his fellow by his garment, and said to Him: "Master of the Universe! I will not let You go until You forgive and pardon them."
Had you mastered the chumesh you would have Known the superiority of moshe rabeinu above all humans including all future leaders Lo Ken Avdi Moshe Bchol Beisi Naamon Hu
And if you would have Chazerd the Ani Mamins at least daily after davening you would have over ruled your arguments with tenet of of faith # 7 "that Moshe rabeinu was superior in prophecy then those before and after him"
and his privileges are not to be emulated
therefore when the rebbe coached us to scream ad musai was only for that ONE purpose that we should also do Whats it is in our hands to help the rebbe to be revealed as Melech Hamoshiach
but after Gimmel Tamuz we have to go back amuna pshuta and wait for meshiach , but whats really happening that every time some has any discomfort they taunt and scorn and degrade HkbH as they understand better then HKB"H how to lead the world , i for one has decided when ever i will hear someone big mouthing against HkbH i will stick up for Kvod Shmeim and in my shul its involved with mesirsas nefesh because there is some one who literally BITES into you whenever you say some thing to respect HKb"H
i beg you open your eyes and see what happened to us and stop using ad Mosai to degrade HKB"H
ad mosai?
ad mosai? till 100 comments, then close this thread.
Mr. Eye "opener",
I was not aware that the 7th Ikar implied that the "Ispashtusa D'Moshe Bchol Dora" was NOT supposed to emulate Moshe. Thank you for clearing that up.
Screaming Ad Mosai and expressing bewilderment and even anger that Moshiach is not here yet or that a person passes away seemingly prematurely is not apikurses (and can hardly be called HKB"H bashing). The very same people, often in the very same sentence express their faith in Hashem that everything He does is for the good and it is not possible to fathom why he does things...And that we must increase in our observance of Torah and Mitzvos and rededicate ourselves to Hashem in order to bring Moshiach...
Congratulations on your new job as Hashem's defense lawyer.
to my dear OlyJew
Rabbi Abbahu himself said : Were it not explicitly written, "it would be impossible to say such a thing" And of course "Ispashtusa D'Moshe Bchol Dora" is One Way
Please don't express bewilderment or anger on HKB"H get to Know Him and his Ways you will start to realize that HKB"H is right His Judgement is Right and his Timing is Accurate and please Join Me "prematurely" in defending the ways of Hashem Before you understand Him, because this is reserved for when Meshiach will be here ,When all (Nations ) Know the ways of HKB"H,
Please help increase our Observance in Torah and Mitzvos starting with the Rambams First Mitzve in sefer Hamitzvos EMUNA
Eye Opener
Are you some escapee from an asylum or some revivalist minister?Either way, I strongly suggest that you get back on your meds.If anyone needs a yeshuah around here it's you.
Eye Opener,
You claim to be the big mamin, but the rotzan hashem is that we should cry and beg that he should change his verdict to our benefit that we see with our fleshy eyes, he made Yitzchok and rivka childless in order that they should pray because he lusts for the Tefila of Tzadikim and he changes the verdict to their benefit. We are crying every Tisha Beov for the churban, according to you why cry, if Hashem made the Churban then its great and lets make it into a purim,
you are missing the basic training of a kindergarten kid
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