Saturday, December 24, 2005

גרויסע רבי קליינע מנורה



(Photo courtesy of Shturem)

A simple aluminum (!) Menorah which the Rebbe had in his posession still from his days in Europe, and which he used until the last Chanukah in New York.

I thought of comparing that to the monstrosities used by the Other Tzaddikim of our generation, but I reconsidered....

44 comments:

c said...

What kind of menayrehs did the other Rebbeim of Lubavitch in the past use ? Any photos or info around ?

C said...

When and where in Europe did he get it ? France ? Berlin ? Russia ? Before the chassunah ? After ?

Hirshel Tzig said...

There's a photo of the FR sitting at the Menayreh in 5710, weeks b4 the histalkus. I'll try and get it posted.

I would refer you to the article at Shturem. Just click on the link.

abc said...

there is some rare photo i think of R Rashab that was in posession of the althaus family in australia.

not sure of details.

Hai Anav VTzaddik said...

I usually get your point, but I am missing this one. Are you trying to say that the Rebbe didn't need a big fancy manora for himself? that is not a good point! I have been by many rebbes who use pashute looking kiddush bechers because they are from the Sanzer or someone else holy. This menora happens to have a special signifigance for the Rebbe. But it didn't stop all the shlichim from erecting the most monstrous menoras ever seen.

abc said...

duvie, did not occur to you that the purpose of the 'monstrous' menorahs that the shluchim erect is to publicise the mitzva aka pirsumei nisa

vml said...

ABC,
Did it occur to you that those 'monstrosities' (Tzig:'nice' name for a dvar mitzvah)are usually lit in a very public way as in front of hundreds OF their chasidim in their beis hamedresh??
Well you are a Lubavitcher so I can't expect you to give a hoot about what other chassidim do,but such ignorance?

Hirshel Tzig said...

VML


Sorry that you take offense, but for some reason I doubt your sincerity. The "craze" of huge Menayres has nothing to do with Pirsumei Nissa. Every two-bit kid today gets a huge one at his wedding. So please, let's not confuse the 2.

Hirshel Tzig said...

Noch a zach:

Admorei Chabad may have had large Menayres in the past, as well as some of the other Malbushei kovod
that seems to "make the man" today with regards to Rebbes and Rosh Yeshivos. In my estimation the Rebbe what has become of the Chitzoneus of Chassidus and abolished it, much like the Nesivos Sholom of Slonim did, albeit to a lesser extent. So too with the Menayres, it's become a joke to see the size of those things today, with each G'vir trying to outdo the other, getting the Rebbe to use the 6 foot menayreh that he bought.

macabee said...

Hirshel, i mamish don't get it. you made a good point & there's no reason to nitpick. I used a similar menorah ( to one depicted) as a bochur. & yes it is intresting to see the Rebbe using that menorahall his years.

LAJEW said...

Macabe…
There is no point to tzigs post, what a shameful, disgraceful and amateurish post.

“I thought of comparing that to the monstrosities used by the Other Tzaddikim of our generation, but I reconsidered....”

You yourself call them Tzadikim so why make fun of them in a back handed comment?
Besides the point that many Tzadikim use the same style menorah.

What do you want to get out from your post, that the rebbe was great? That he was one of a kind? A Nossi? Tzadik Hador? That we know without your pathetic post. There is absolutely no way you should disparage other Tzadikim and leaders of communities that was NOT the derech of the Rebbe.

Change you name to TIPISH

Hirshel Tzig said...

It's amazing to me that such noble and tolerant people like the above poster that claim to care about everybody else have no problem being judge and jury when it comes to me. They claim to know what I mean even when I don't write my feelings, and have no qualms about attacking me. It sounds like a typical guy who preaches "tolerance" and "free-speech" yet only allows opinions that concur with them.....

RIETSguy said...

I guess you might say "short people wear high heels".

Hai Anav VTzaddik said...

I was also surprised that you called them Tzaddikim. i ssume you mean Tzaddikim that they do good things, while the Rebbe is a Tanya Tzaddik.

Hirshel Tzig said...

Duvie et. al.:

don't take my words so literally, if you like i'll change it to Rebbes, (or Rebbelach...)

vml said...

Tzig:Please don't act as if the gist of your posts(and blog) was misunderstood.You are trying to prove, show etc how great your rebbe was by minimizing all and any others (unless they were 'mekabel malchus' dahn veren they 'tsadikim')
You could have made a nice positive post:'Look at the simple menorah of the Rebbe' ,instead you take a slap at the other 'wannabee' rebbes.That's your choice, but why the righteous indignation when we, the frum world don't see it your way, when instead of seeing mivtza moshiach as positive we see it for the Moshichist/yechi/boreinu mess it has left us with.
Practice what you preach

Hirshel Tzig said...

VML

what can I say, you're totally posessed, and need to see some sort of witch doctor.

Every post needs to end up with Yechi?Boreinu? Can you never address the topic at hand?

VML said...

Tzig:I did address the subject at hand:Your need to make everybody small to make your REBBE GREAT.
BTW I don't end every post with yechi or boreinu, however is it not 'interesant' that the only 'chasides' that has many members who think/say their rebbe who passed on many years back is alive or..........chas vesholom 'creator of the world' is the Chochma ,bina voda'as chasides.That does not bother you, you are bothered that some rebbes have beautiful menorahs.

Hirshel Tzig said...

VML

you're absolutely correct. That and the only religion that had Communism, Socialism, Zionism, Reform, Bugsy Siegel and the ACLU was the religion that claims to have a monopoly on G-d.










J-U-D-A-I-S-M.




FOOD FOR THOUGHT.

vml said...

Ahem........were all of the members of the above groups Orthodox Jews?Did they keep shabos, grow beards, study 'chasides'?
I thought not.
So let's reiterate the question:Why is it that a so called 'chassides'made up of ostensibly Orthodox Jews is the only ORTHODOX group where many members believe that their deceased leader is 'alive' or the 'creator' chas vesholom?
Please note:The Lubavitcher are not members of the ELVIS Presley Lives fan club, though it may seem so, neither are they members of the UFO club.

Hirshel Tzig said...

ich veis nit ver Elvis Presley is, but the point is clear. How can Judaism be the true religion when this is what it produces?!

LAJEW said...

Just for the record tzig, are you placing the Meshichistim with
>Communism, Socialism, Zionism, Reform, Bugsy Siegel and the ACLU< ?

Hirshel Tzig said...

which records do you keep?

Hirshel Tzig said...

LAJew
if I did would I tell you and give you the satisfaction? noooooooo.

LAJEW said...

Ferd, I mean Tzig that exactly what you wrote
VML

you're absolutely correct. That and the only religion that had Communism, Socialism, Zionism, Reform, Bugsy Siegel and the ACLU was the religion that claims to have a monopoly on G-d.










J-U-D-A-I-S-M.

Hirshel Tzig said...

did I ever tell anybody I was a masochist?

bring it on LAJew, VML, I can take it.

vml said...

The problem with the Lubavitcher is that they never look at their own backyard.The Moshichists own 770, make sure the Rebbe still gets to his seat unobstructed by making a 'shura' for him at the beginning of every prayer service.He still gets aliyahs, etc.
In fact the so called 'rational' Lubavitch spent hundreds of thousands of dollars for 24 hour security to guard a plaque which referred to the Rebbe as deceased to no avail.That stone was still shmashed.Back at the ranch our dear Tzig is bothered that some rebbes have large menorahs....................................
Get back to us when you manage to persuade Ariel Sokolovsky and his fellow 'elokisten' that the Rebbe is not G-d chas vesholom.We will than discuss the 'important' issues of menorah sizes

LAJEW said...

Happy Chanukah

macabee said...

phew! lajew! come on, what has you worked up today?

LAJEW said...

In the spirit of Chanukah, I wish you all a meaningful Chanukah.
Tzig just for your info, (if you want it) I love Lubavitch, I am Lubavitch and a Chosid of Lubavitch, I just dont think you do a good job in defending or being an advocate for Lubavitch, sometimes its better to do what you have to do (Tairah, mitzvos vechuli) and as the song goes, aler soinim zolen plazten.

ch'sidshe tourist said...

Thanx for posting the pic. It reminds me of an old chakirah I've had: in the sicha where the Rebbe speaks of the true shape of the Menorah, the Rebbe said it is "kdai" that chanukah menorahs should be made "ba'alochson" instead of round "l'hoitze mida'as ha'toim". L'poiel, the Rebbe himself used this Menorah with a wall (as were the menorahs of all the other rebbeim, correct me if i'm wrong) Ubimeila, is a real mikushar supposed to use a "rambam menorah" altz the sicha or a menorah with a wall altz ma'ase rav?

Hirshel Tzig said...

I say wall. The Rambam menayreh is only for the large ones like in public. V'chain ani noheg.

ch'sidshe tourist said...

that's probably only cuz your shver got you that one. maybe hu gufa is a raya.

Hirshel Tzig said...

My shver gave me the money, I did the purchasing.

RIETSguy said...

what about "Hiddur Mitzvah"?

Isn't that the point of having large silver Menorahs?

Hirshel Tzig said...

Hiddur Mitzva is the most overused term these days. Everybody who wants to be Memaleh Tayve blames the Mitzvah. Please.

Anonymous said...

And I thought 'the Lubavitcher Rebbe says' was the most overused term

bpunbound said...

No, the most overused term these days is....

WOULD YOU PLEASE TAKE A NAME, BLOCKHEAD!

not anon no more said...

Hey bum, you forgot to drink your vodka today?
Chill out

Kurenitzer said...

Yasher Kayach, es kert mir brechen fun di greyse meneyres fun unzere hayntike zadikim. The teitch is ZEH Keli (mit a Kof - dos is my keli - my ego -) veanvayhu and I will glorify my ego.
Why is it that the Litvishe roshe yeshiva and the lubavitcher rebbe used small Menorahs and rebbes from other countries especially Medinas H need huge menoras ?
Again Yeyasher I have never sen a photo of the rebbe's Menorah it made my week of chanukah

Hirshel Tzig said...

Es freit mir di hartz to see that you approve. I'm proud to be the source of your happiness.

thanbo said...

Wonder how old that hanukkiah is? If it predates 1886, it could have been worth a lot of money when it was made. Aluminum used to be very expensive to refine, until the Hall-Heroult process made it cheap & easy in 1886 (first factory using this process built 1888 in Pittsburgh, USA).

Hirshel Tzig said...

Thanbo

it was bought new in the 1940's, so I doubt it pre-dates 1886.

yc said...

"I was also surprised that you called them Tzaddikim. i ssume you mean Tzaddikim that they do good things, while the Rebbe is a Tanya Tzaddik."

IIRC, a distinction is made between a Tzaddik and a Rebbe (Regarding the usage as explained in tanya)