Hebrew Discussion
The late Belzer Rov (Yohrtzeit 21 Av) was probably the last of the "undisputed Tzaddikim." By that I mean that even the biggest Misnagdishe Mechutzef wouldn't dare open his mouth against him, and even the Satmar Rov, who had no problem disagreeing with Rishonim, very much wanted to win over the BR when it came to setting policy regarding the Charedi approach to the Government in Israel. It didn't bother him what the Roshei Yeshivah and other Rebbes at the time decided, it was the BR that was the stickler for him. He traveled to the Holy Land to try and change the BR's mind, but to no avail. He considered his trip as a failure of sorts, since that was ultimately the goal of the visit, the visits with Chassidim and the Droshos against voting in the elections were secondary.
What was there to dispute you may ask? According to me nothing at all, but some of the "defenders of the faith" in the Yeshivisher world surely would've had a problem - KeVayochol - with many of his Hanhogos. Yet, for some reason they dared not open their mouths, at least not publicly. It may depress some of you that we've lived for fifty years without a replacement of that stature, and we'll live for another fifty for sure without seeing another one. But look at the bright side; it can only mean one thing: Moshiach will either come very soon, or the world will come to it's end. Either way we'll go to a better place.
20 comments:
misnagdishe mechutzaphim? kaveeyochul?
You are some worthless piece of garbage? What on Earth DID your mother do to you?
I read today that the Belzer Rov said yesterday by the Tzion ( in Belz there is no Ohel) that His uncle was considered by Chasidim to be Moshiach!!
I am amazed at your ignorance that Reb Aron Belzer was universal accepted, In Williamsburgh he was vilified after he didn't agree to the Satmar Rebbe's anti zionoist rage,
Just FYI at the hesped in the Viener shul by Reb Yonosson Stief, Reb Hillel Lichtenstien and Tzelemer Rov no Satmar chasidim were to attend, in the last minute they called for a Satmar Function as a chanukas habais Etc..
In the Satmar media he didn't exist for 30 years until they were able to use him against Belz of today.
Sheail Ovicho Veyagedcho
I agree the matzev is depressing but you better adjust your meds.
Frankly, I attended Lubavitch schools in the years of 1956-1965 and I never heard the man you call "an udisputed Zaddik of his generation " ever mentioned in the school. Of course I heard about him and his petirah and the nephew he left from my parents.
While we know that the Rayaatz tried helping in the rescue of the Belzer ruv from Poland and their cordial relationship. He called him Seer Besori (from their Twersky connection). There seems to have been no relationship between the 7th rebbe and the Belzer ruv after 1951.
As an aside the Belzer ruv was want to reply to Rosh hashonaa (Birchas Hashonna)greetings as late as Pesach time. In the year the Rayaatz passed on, he failed to reply to the greeting of the Rayaatz until after Yud Shevat. In Nissan his Gabbe R. Sholom Fogel was told to reply , F told the ruv that the Rayaatz was gone and left 2 sons in law, so to which should the reply be addressed, the ruv answered to the older one...
It seems that the last Lubavitcher Rebbe met the Belzer ruv in Berlin incognito in the 1930's and the Belzer ruv "smelled" him out - as a special person a Zaddik nistar.
After the War the rashag met the Ruv and the ruv told him that every jew who survived ahd 2 M;lochim guarding him.Taht story is brought down in many places but the rashag is not always mentioned.
Moshiach will either come very soon, or the world will come to it's end.
Don't khop the either/or. What Jew who's a ma'amin has any other possible scenario for the world's end than y'mos haMoshiakh and T'khias haMesim?
According to the Tzig even 'misnagdishe mechutzofim' recognize real greatness.Well according to that logic how does Chabad fit in?You would think that 'even' they would recognize ?
I'm just answering begeder 'aneh kesil'-But you show that you are stam a bored idiot.You know well enough that the biggest machloikesn with the biggest mechuttzofim have been the inter chasidic wars, not misnagdishe mecutzofim. And a shoiteh you are because you A)Are and B)Because you blog about such stupidity over and over again.Your Lubab friends agree with your anti snag sentiments, so who exactly are you preaching to with this crud?Especially since your whole dumb blog from the beginning has been rerepeating these ideas.Sheesh...
C)Unfortunately these days have been very sad and there is much news to blog about, but the na'ar is a one track mind.....
Ah naar blaybt a naar.
'The Satmar Ruv had no problem disagreeing with Rishoinim'
Can you back this claim up with any examples or is another of your false claims??
Shneur
what is the source on the birchas hashone letter ?
Misnagdishe Mechutzofim are little Misnagdim that speak up about people - Malochim really - and negate their Geonus and Tzidkus based on the 7 Yeshivishe Mesechtos they learned, and only the first 20 blatt of those. The Belzer Rov somehow avoided their wrath, the Rebbe did not.
false claims? I think not. The Satmar Rov had no problem disagreeing with Rishonim when he fet the need. I spoeak of conversations I've had with farbrente satmare chassidim.
re: satmar not accepting the late BR:
The point then was to show that it was Tziyonus Uber Alles, or anti-Tziyonus rather, not to ch"v condemn the Rov.
I heard the birchas hashona story from Israeli Belzer people many years ago.
Obviously the Belzer rav was not familiar with the situation here in CH and did the logical. But the Jewish way is not always the logical... Certainly the Chassidishe way is not always what it seems to be.
>>The Belzer Rov somehow avoided their wrath, the Rebbe did not.
No Rebbe aside from the Rebbe was. . .and, to be fair and honest, lets not pretend that the many Gedolim who expressed strong reservations about the Rebbe and his practices knew only 7 mesechtos. They knew at least as much as the Rebbe, and at least as well. You may have a problem with the buchurim who insult the Rebbe, but they know more than you. . . and look at how you talk about gedolei Tayreh. You are too hypocritical to be taken seriously on this issue.
Schneur
I would like to update you with 2 facts
The 2nd Belzer Rebbe Reb Yehoshoya was the 5th in the family
and the 3rd Rebbe Reb YD was the 2nd son
So logic illogic is nonsense its the way the chassidim wanted.
Desser
Isn't the Satmar Rov the staunch anti shitas Ramban regarding Yishuv Eretz Yisroel and most achronim believe that even the Rambam holds that mitzvas Yishuv E Y is a mitzva in our times, I understand he found sources as the Meil Tzedoka but the bottom line it's political as 90% of his torah is.
where did the anonymouse loose all his screws? he is talking like a 2 yr old
I am impressed with the anon genius who claims that the Satmar rebbe was staunch anti-shitas Ramban re YEY"
Efshar u can show us where you get this from?
Definitely not in his magnum opus the Vayoel Moshe!
"There seems to have been no relationship between the 7th rebbe and the Belzer ruv after 1951."
There actually WAS a relationship, a very warm one, which is illustrated by the following story:
In the early years of the Rebbe's Nesius, he sent out a letter "to all Admurim shyeyichye", which included der heiliger Belzer.
When the letter got to the EY, his secratery brought it to him, while saying,mockingly, something to the effect of " A new Rebbe in America is coming to bother you". The BR gave him a sharp look and said something to the effect of "R' Seagel(?), beware,for you are playing with fire!".
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