Monday, June 23, 2008

(Not) Remembering Chof Sivan

It's sad that most people don't know much about this infamous day. Yes, there are some kehillos that say Selichos, and maybe some old timers still fast, but for the most part it's a forgotten day. I was trying to say that it's because the Holocaust eclipsed those murders twentyfold, and that if people don't remember the Holocaust why should they remember 300 years before that.... A friend tells me he went to a wedding that had a star-studded lineup packed with Roshei Yeshivah, and nobody danced any less. The zealots in Israel seem to have made something of it after all, they founded the Keren Hatzoloh organization for those mosdos asher lo kor'u l'Ba'al, and now are commemorating 30 years of educating children with only non-Zionist money....

Nu, Nu.


Anonymous said...

speaking about telshe-they say tach vtat selichos on "chof tamuz"

The Bray of Fundie said...

where are such slichos printed? I'd be very curious to see them.

Anonymous said...

They are printed in many siddurim, including many very common ones. Take a look in Shul.

The Bray of Fundie said...

under what heading?

The Bray of Fundie said...

is tha Greek or Latin under the portrait? Where did you copy it from?

here's the statue in Kiev wher he's considered a national hero.

can you imagine germany getting away with a statue hailing Hitler YM"S astride a horse, as a national hero?

I guess old Bogdan gets away with it since he only slaughtered Jews whereas Hitler cost plently of other lives as well.

Hirshel Tzig said...

Latin. Greek is written in a different alphabet. The pic is from Wiki.

schneur said...

After the Holocaust the only Jewish community in East Central Europe to survive "in tact" to some extent Budapest saw its Beth Din issue a proclamaition proclaiming Chof Sivan as a memorial day for the Holocaust.
I think the Poper synagogues and for sure the Bratzlover shuls say Selichos on that day.

Anonymous said...

there is a city in ukraine named after him, not far from mezhibuzh,
also, he is on the 2 "grivni" bill in ukraine.

Anonymous said...

I think it is real shanda bordering on the decadent for the entire Jewish Hareidi community to forget and let this day pass as if nothing.

300,000 Jews were butchered in the most gruesome way. What do we have? An entire nation dumping on its martyrs! What an historical shame! If moshiach doesnt come soon our einiklech will treat the holocaust in the same way. How? With not even a shrug.

Why did Rebbe Nachman choose to be buried in Uman because all the קדושים of that town were buried near his grave and he wanted to be layed to rest next to them. Today we have Chasidim visiting Ukraine and in which Hotel do they go to in in Kiev? Didn't anybody hear of the nice hotel called the Hitler?..oooops the Chmelnitzky Hotel!(my mistake)

Disgust is not the right word.

Click here and you can order your Hitler neck-tie and pen. (boots are free)

Yosef 718

אבינו מלכינו נקום נקמת דם עבדיך השפוך

Anonymous said...

No wonder they can't escape their status as such a sh*thole. They're undoubtedly cursed.

Anonymous said...

I was witness to the great Didan Notzach over Bogdan yemach shmo. My son and a friend were on shlichus in Ukraine for Yomim Tovim. He was all of 17 years old. They got themselves an interview in the media to invite all Yidden to come and prave the Yomtov (I don't recall if Tishrei or Pesach ) with the shluchim, and the mayor invited them to his office. To see these two Tmimim mamosh kinder, under the picture of Bogdan Chmelnitzki, in his territory, he being dead and they being chay lehachyeis, was a true Didan Notzach. And there is no greater hanooa than using the 2 grivny bill to shop for a farbrengen. Ishapcha at its' finest!

Shalom Ash said... has it

The 20th of Sivan is the anniversary of the first blood libel in France. On this date in 1171, tens of Jewish men and women were burned alive in the French town of Blois on the infamous accusation that Jews used to the blood of Christian children in the preparation of matzot for Passover. For a detailed account see link below.

Mottel said...

I wrote this comment earlier, but lost it by mistake before I could publish it . . . Here it is again
A few things to note:
Ukrainian Money
still has his picture.

Bogdan killed not only Jews, but Poles as well (the numbers in no way compare -he killed between 40,000 to 100,000 Yidden . . . Hashem Yikum damam and l'havdil several thousands of Poles) as his revolt was against the Szlachta, with the Jewish Arendars who worked for them the easy scapegoat.

As such, to the Ukrainians and Russians Bogdan is seen as a unifier of the Eastern Slavic peoples from the hands of the Poles . . . Eliminating that image, one so engraved in their mass psyche, is much harder then that of Hitler.

Schneur said...

Are you certain that Telz says Slichos. In general Chmiel and his hordes did little damage to Reisen and Lithuania and he Jewish community was in general unaffected. This is even noted by the Bes Rebbe in his book.

Hirshel Tzig said...


You DO know the story with the Shach, right? He came from Vilna.

Anonymous said...

telz recites these selichos on chof tamuz lzecher kedoshei telz of the holocaust hashem yinkom domom

Mottel said...

He was in Krakow at the time . . .

Anonymous said...

rav yc zonenfeld was once asked to give a hamlatza for a school whith limudei chol in ey when he refused he asked the principal if he thaught any of the students where a potential moshiach, the principal said no. rycz said chinuch has to be given to each yiddishe kind with the potential moshiach in mind and THATS why I won't give u a haskama.

keren hatzola has what to celebrate.

Anonymous said...

"the principal said no."

I guess they were all kohanim.

Friendly Anonymous said...

What am I missing? we say Ov Horachamim on Shabbos Mevorchim Sivan for this reason.

Anonymous said...

In Belz they say the Selichoth I guess in Galicia (today Ukraine) was effected by this monster.

Arthur said...

Route 17: Fenway, Crosley And 770

Article taken from the ,of all places,the Jewish week blog of June 19

For a number of years, cynics would get a good laugh out of the fact that Kfar Chabad, the Lubavitch town in Israel, built a duplicate
of the rebbe's headquarters, 770 Eastern Parkway .

The duplicate 770 was said to be indicative of how crazy and messianist the Chabadniks were, they must have been expecting the rebbe to drop in, pretty funny. Only a chasid could be so nuts, right?

Wrong. I'm not a chasid and I understand completely. When I went to Epcot I got a kick out of the recreations of town squares in Paris and Morocco, and the animatronic presidents in the Magic Kingdom. I like seeing the duplicate Statue of Liberty on a rooftop near Lincoln Center.

Any Jewish soul with a sense of history would be understanding of an Israeli chasid's natural longing to be reminded of a place so beautiful, historic, and evocative of perhaps the greatest Jewish story of the 20th century -- second only to the rebirth of Israel -- the rebbe's campaign to find, love and serve every single Jew on the planet, from the Congo to Kansas.

Baseball fans have built replicas of Fenway's Green Monster.

After the Cincinnati Reds abandoned Crosley Field, those who loved it built a duplicate in Blue Ash, Kentucky, with 600 of the original seats. You can see the outfield wall here , here and here .

The new Yankee Stadium will attempt to replicate the original, the way it was before it was redone in 1976.

Last week, The New York Times (June 15) ran a front-page photo, with an accompanying story, about a beachfront hotel in Turkey,
designed to appeal to Russian tourists. The Kremlin Palace Hotel's buildings are replicas of the Kremlin and the onion domes of St. Basil's Cathedral .

This summer, thousands will be visiting Williamsburg, Virginia to see the recreations. Williamsburg, Brooklyn, attempts a spiritual recreation of Satmar in the Carpathians.

A few days ago, I was in Crown Heights, at the original 770, for a wedding in the alley - an alley just big enough for a chuppah, and ten flanking rows of folding chairs -- between 770 and the Chabad library.

After the ceremony I touched the outer bricks; touched the brick fountain that's gone dry in the small yard in the rear; walked through the old hefty front door into 770's hallway where the rebbe used to stand; and down the narrow, twisting stairway into the great block-long fabrenegen hall.

In 1979 it seemed much larger, the size of a football field, or the Temple Mount's plateau. It now seems the size of a shul, or yeshiva study room.

Were there some signs and stickers about Moshiach? Yes. Did it matter? No more than a visit to Jerusalem's Wall would be disturbed by seeing foxes on the Temple Mount. It wouldn't matter anymore than it would to see bumper stickers for McCain and Obama, evidence of mortals and lesser men, in Jefferson's Monticello. What the rebbe did here goes far beyond anyone's poor power to add or detract.

There was holiness in 770, such as tourists would spend thousands of dollars in airfare to see on heritage tours to the Polish woods or the Ukrainian countryside. In Brooklyn, you can see it - the real thing - for the price of a subway token.

I closed my eyes and ran my fingers over the bricks like a blind man running his fingertips over the face of a beauty queen from some year before I was born.


The Bray of Fundie said...

Bravo. Beautiful. Well done. I particularly like the part about the dimensions themselves seeming to shrink in the great man's ZY"A absence.

And I'm not even a Chabadnik.

Anonymous said...

you dont have to be a chabadnik to be an idiot, but it shure helps

Mottel said...

And you don't have to be an idiot to misspell sure, but it sure helps