No, we're not talking about the Shabbos parades they used to have back in the 30's and 40's, where frum Jews would tell Jewish shopkeepers who had their stores open that they were violating the Torah by doing business on the day of rest. Here we speak of Jews who took it upon themselves to harass other frum Jews who rely on the Rabbinic "solution" that allows carrying outside the home by using an eruv. These zealots have a problem with some people having the freedom to move about town, and Shabbos takes the "blame." They say that the Shabbos has an issue with this freedom of movement, and that they wish to defend the holy day's honor. They do this by making the lives of the more vulnerable a living H E double hockey sticks. Nobody likes to be yelled at on the street, no matter how right or innocent they may be, and no matter how crazy the one doing the yelling may be. It's good to see that even those who suffer from indigestion and heartburn (are they one and the same?) can also pass the time productively by yelling at mothers out for a Shabbos stroll with their young'uns, or fathers carrying their heavy Terkishe Tallis home on a hot summer's day after spending 4 hours at his first cousin's Shabbos Sheva Brochos.
61 comments:
There's an eruv in Williamsburg?
First they came after those who had the store open on Shabbos. And no-one objected.
Then they came after those who were Lubavitch. And no one objected.
Then they came after those who had real sfeikus Be-emena yet were shomrei Torah U'mitsos (Ami magazine). And no one objected.
Then they came after those who had different piskei Shabbos. And no-one objected.
Then they came after me. But there was no-one left to object.
Why criticize the pashute Yidden , go for the rabbis who encourage this sort of nonsense and for many it is just a political issue.
Schneur
You are correct,
the simple difference between the boro park and willi eruvin, is that in Willi the eruv coincided with the establishment of the Zali Rebbe, Satmar rebivesteve. In order to earn the title of being a satmar rebbe, you need to be Riesh Shien Ayin, even if your are not by nature, as all the Birech Moshe kids are not by nature evil, but you have to follow the local hood, in order to succeed. Their father was a nobody in Willi, even after being ordained as Rebbe of Satmar, untill he started the ruthless jihad against the Belzer, The hood started to respect him as he is one of us.
yidel says:
Williamsburg (with all their faults) is the craddle of un compromised yiddisheket in america this is a well known fact for those who want to know it, there is a reason why 90% of the yiddishe residents there are satmarer or affiliated with satmar, it wasn’t always like that people of genteel nature (even frum ones) moved from there in the 50’s and 60’s yes their was a hot discussion of making an erev there with than the prager ruv the weiner ruv (reb yonoson) and reb michuel ber weismandel z”l who where for it and they backed down from the idea when they had a meeting with the satmarer ruv z”l and they ‘felt’ he was not pleased with it! Since then no one considered it because it was not to his z”l ‘liking’ even now most residents living there are of satmer nature who respect his wishes! And the ones who want the erev (the residents and their rabunim) are from a minority (with an agenda!!!) certainly with no backing from the majority Or the unbrella organization of rabunim of willimamsurg the ‘hisachdus harabunim’ this holy city is what it is don’t touch it!!!
Am HaArtzus sheBe Am HaArtzus!
In the pledge card pictured you can pledge "2 shabbosim, 4 shabbosim..."
Shabbos is feminine. The plural is "shabbasos"! I'm sorry, but I am not taking any lessons in psak halacha or minhag from people whose understanding of LaHa"K is obviously too deficient to be able to read the seforim "inside".
"Am HaArtzus sheBe Am HaArtzus!"
is this greek ?
to Schneur:
"you need to be Riesh Shien Ayin"
look who is calling the kettle black.
"is this greek ?"
No, its a "tumedike sprach" and, leshitascha, you are not allowed to read or speak it.
It's a mitzveh to write without dikduk. The biggest joke is zechuso yogein oleinu-it should be togein. Only maskilim,sefardim, and outright zionists care about dikduk.Who cares that Tanach and Mishnayos are written al pi dikduk?
"leshitascha"
this is not greek or any other language just a translitiration of hebrew which was first devised by moshe mendelsohn ym"s hopefully youre the lsat one.
can't sleep because of the cholent?
i never heard of that b4.
Yidel
" is the craddle of un compromised yiddisheket in america this is a well known fact for those who want to know it,"
what makes it holier then BP,Monsey and Lakewood, because they do drink unfiltered water and eat low sodium matzohs?
Anon
"their was a hot discussion of making an erev there with than the prager ruv the weiner ruv (reb yonoson) and reb michuel ber weismandel z”l who where for it and they backed down from the idea"
who is the source for this lie? the old Hoiz Bocher Reb Moshe Ber Wienberger? the production manager of the 15 volume lies Moshian Shel Yisroel, this guy had no idea which part of Shulchan orech, hilchas eruvin was printed in.
"what makes it holier then..."
BP,Monsey and Lakewood are fine yidishe neighborhoods by products from wmsb'g
http://matzav.com/organization-encourages-children-to-promote-controversial-boro-park-eiruv
Its simply fighting fire with fire.
yidel says:
“Williamsburg (with all their faults) is the craddle of un compromised yiddisheket in america this is a well known fact for those who want to know it, there is a reason why 90% of the yiddishe residents there are satmarer or affiliated with satmar, it wasn’t always like that people of genteel nature (even frum ones) moved from there in the 50’s and 60’s”
Uncompromised Yiddishkeit! This is only assumed by those who live in Williamsburg. No one else would agree with this statement.
“yes their was a hot discussion of making an erev there with than the prager ruv the weiner ruv (reb yonoson) and reb michuel ber weismandel z”l who where for it and they backed down from the idea when they had a meeting with the satmarer ruv z”l and they ‘felt’ he was not pleased with it!”
This is revisionism. They wrote teshuvos supporting an eruv. Show me one teshuvah that they retracted. Show me one teshuvah from the Satmar rebbe that he opposed an eruv. I never knew the Stamar rebbe to shy away from writing his opinion especially if he was so opposed to something.
“Since then no one considered it because it was not to his z”l ‘liking’”
No one considered it? How about all the Satmarer rabbanim who wrote letters supporting an eruv between the years of 1972-1981? Please don’t rewrite history.
“even now most residents living there are of satmer nature who respect his wishes!”
All the Satmarer rabbanim who actually knew the rebbe supported an eruv. That some, who where in diapers when the rebbe was alive, want to rewrite history doesn’t change the facts.
“And the ones who want the erev (the residents and their rabunim) are from a minority (with an agenda!!!) certainly with no backing from the majority Or the unbrella organization of rabunim of willimamsurg the ‘hisachdus harabunim’ this holy city is what it is don’t touch it!!!”
Where does is say that you need a majority to establish an eruv? There is no such thing. Every rav has a right and a chiyuv to establish an eruv if he deems it permissible. What’s the agenda, to carry just like in all other cities?
Oib es tut vay shraiyt men!
i would like to spend a Shabbos in Willi , just to be un'geshreit.
Seriously, these are guys who dont have the nerven for a Blatt Gemorah Shabbos NuchMittog, so they have to be Koineh Oilem Habu some other way.
i was in the mikva in klozenberg the first shabbos of this so called eiruv and heard them gloating "ushvor oil satmer me'al tzavuraini"...
An
"there is a reason why 90% of the yiddishe residents there are satmarer or affiliated with satmar,"
the reason is simple, Lipa Friedman and his goons terorized evry yid that was thinking different then 500 Bedford
Anon-
"i was in the mikva in klozenberg the first shabbos of this so called eiruv and heard them gloating "ushvor oil satmer me'al tzavuraini"..."
Even if someone said this silly statement is this a reason to be mevatal a mitzvah d'rabbanan? You guys don't care about Torah only about mi brosh.
Anon
"i was in the mikva in klozenberg the first shabbos"
It looks alittle sucpicios that a non klause nburger should visit that particular Mikveh,there are too many satmar affiliated ritual baths on these few blocks, it is a lie as Moshe ber Weinbergers lies.
I heard from someone that was in Willi last Shabos, that in the afternoon the marches and the hollering, reminded Holocaust survivors of the SS coming in to town, to round up people in to the Ghettos. My friend was learning Hilchot Shabos with a survivor and the furheaded hooligans started with their marches.the eldery jew commented the above.
How did they stoop so low,is beyond me? is it the constant sinas yisroel brainwashing in their mushed up brains?
I was there that first shabbos and watched zali march down the streets singing shabbos songs beautifully, there wasn't any shouting going on during the march.
It was pathetic to watch the loosers carrying their taleisim home just lehachis 'cuz r fishele said u can
If an Eiruv is so essential, why isn't there on in Kahn Tzivo Hashem Es Habrocho?
To all Anon's" and "David said..."
klein yingelec go read the sefer "toras chemed" from rabbi weismandel z"l and you will find most of the info/sources i related to the kleine yingelch (yutz's) like y'all
The future of Yiddishkeit and Chassidishkeit is the ahavas Yisroel of Lipa Schmeltzer, not the kanois of whoever took over from Lipa Friedman.
Am I right that Lipa Friedman is related to Moishe "Gabbai" Friedman and therefore to M.A.F. of erstwhile Vienna fame?
Anon
Groise Yingel
can you give some synopsis of the toras chemed, and teach the small boys.
"Groise Yingel"
it is available in print in your local book store for all who want to know the truth.
is it on Hebrewbooks,or you can it the few pages I will not buy a sefer just for one issue
Toras chemed. http://hebrewbooks.org/42028
This whole eruv thing creates a dilemma. On the one hand I want to carry to stick it to the furries. On the other, there are other furries who are carrying too.
Anon 12:24:00 PM-
Right and you didn’t see him kick a carriage (Zali Filup)? You didn’t see the bochurim chasing women with a carriages down the street? I guess in Stamar this pritzus is allowed.
You can read their minds, they were carrying l’hachis. All the people in Yerushlayim who carry their talesiim are also l’hachis.
Leibel Schenkel -
It's brought down twice in the Shulchan Aruch that the establishment of an eruv is a mitzvah.
Anon 12:50:00 PM -
"klein yingelec go read the sefer "toras chemed" from rabbi weismandel z"l and you will find most of the info/sources i related to the kleine yingelch (yutz's) like y'all"
Groise yingel, I challenge you to find one word about retraction in the Toras Chemed. Maybe you mean Ish Chamudos, but that book is typical of all the Satmar styled books that redact history. Let’s hear all their arguments, and I will show you how they rewrote history.
David
Correct you are, Rav Wiessmandel in the toras chemed, writes a few pro eruv teshuvahs, and this idiots saw some wishfull visions.
"I challenge you.."
you dont have to challenge me just read a t'shivou (response) written by reb micuel ber z"l himself and printed in his sefer "toras chemed" that he retreats from what he wrote earlier about an erev in williamsburg read 1-2-3 times until you to will get it BYE
to: David'l
the gemorah says thinks that can be proven otherwise people don’t lie about them! well youre behind the pail.. go read them AGAIN.. maybe this time you will see them.. He retracts from what he said earlier and states that he is not competent to involve in this issue!
Anon -
Clearly you can’t read. The last teshuvah Rav Michoel Dov wrote (Toras Chemed, siman 3, dated September 8, 1951) was in support of a Brooklyn eruv. What Rav Michoel Dov meant by שנתלה הדבר להלכה באשלי רברבי was not that the Stamar rebbe was already involved only that Rav Yonasan Steif is at this time involved in the matter. This is what Michoel Dov wrote in his first teshuvah (Toras Chemed, siman 1) אלא לדבר דבור הנוגע למעשה, ובענין זה יש לי עצה טובה. ידענא בי' בגברא רבא, זקן ויושב בישיבה, ובעל הוראה מפורסם ע"פ דרכי הוראה של מרן הח"ס ותלמידיו זי"ע, הגאון האמתי וצדיק תמים, מוהר"ר יונתן שטייף נ"י שיש לו כח דהיתרא לשם שמים. טוב הדבר למעשה להכניסו בהוראה זו
Please don't try to rewite history.
Anon -
The Gemara’s klal, “kol milsa d’avidi l’igluyey lo meshakrei bah enashei,” is not referring to Satmar. They can argue that it’s day when it’s night.
David said... (or tipish said) you quoting the wrong tshivu keep turning the pages and you will see one separate tshviu i think only one page long where he retracts and writes that he has no more saying on this topic and he is not a posek 'bemukom gedolim al tamud' sorry, but your hate creates your blindness as seen here in your inuendos!
ps: And what you write that he wanted reb yonusen z”l involved, that has to do because the klusher.. whom he hated .. got involved.. and he wanted to circumvent the politics of the time.. vedal.
Anon 126
The who?? Wasn't he his BIL??
Never knew there was family rift.
Anon 126
yes he was his BIL he knew him well and he chased him out from his 'yeshiva' with a cane/stick! I heard this from many eye witness he dispised him.
Who chased who???
Rumor has it that RMB was the shadchan and asked the SR for "information".
RMB chased 'him' and about SR as shadcen well.. lets not go there now.
Didn't know the BIL paid a visit to the Yeshiva Farm Settlement.
Was this rift part of the Satmar character assassination and lynch or was this on a personal level?
"Was this rift part of the Satmar character assassination"
is bin laden dead? did he crash the towers?
listen fool get out of your stupididty than will talk, bye.
wow, this "rift" between RMBW and his BIL is news to me.
It proves that no one is immune from what Jews do best, i.e. fight amongst themselves.
The only recent ones who might have been immune, and I'm not sure of them, are R Moshe and the Chofetz Chaim. Maybe Chazon Ish too, it doesnt appear any Chasidishe Rebbes would appear on this list, maybe Skulener or some other B-List Rebbes.
Anon
"I heard this from many eye witness he dispised him"
I think the problem is, that the eyewitness despised the Klausenburger, and the story was fabricated, so go back to the nursing home and search out this eyewitness, after wiping off his runny nose,
Tell him in his face "di bizt a alter shakran" and then call his aide to wheel him back to the porch to chatch some flies.
Anon
"Was this rift part of the Satmar character assassination and lynch or was this on a personal level?"
Coming from Willi, I can vouch you, that no tactic was hold back to smear the great Tzadik of Klausenburgh.
Anon
" that has to do because the klusher.. whom he hated .. got involved.."
Ein Kietz Ledivrie ruach
Anon-
“David said... (or tipish said) you quoting the wrong tshivu keep turning the pages and you will see one separate tshviu i think only one page long where he retracts and writes that he has no more saying on this topic and he is not a posek 'bemukom gedolim al tamud' sorry, but your hate creates your blindness as seen here in your inuendos!”
Groise yingele, I reiterate I quoted the last teshuvah (see the dates) regarding eruvin. In any case, from your quote it’s clear you don’t know his teshuvos from the original only from the Yalkut Michzavim. It is irrelevant that Rav Michoel Dov stated in his later teshuvos that he won’t pasken since he said that he is not issuing a p’sak even in his first teshuvah. So my dear groise yingele, your argument does not prove that he retracted at all, since he maintained that he was not going to pasken from the get go. However, Rav Michoel Dov was very much involved in establishing eruvin and even drew maps of Brooklyn detailing alternative ways to establish one. Up until lately Rav Michoel Dov was always considered a major advocate for eruvin. You are a revisionist, and not a good one at that.
“ps: And what you write that he wanted reb yonusen z”l involved, that has to do because the klusher.. whom he hated .. got involved.. and he wanted to circumvent the politics of the time.. vedal.”
Now you are kleina yingele. The Klausenberger rebbe was never involved with the 1949-1962 Manhattan eruv or the Williamsburger eruv. This is simple revisionism. You have no proof to this spurious claim. No, Rav Michoel Dov wrote explicitly why they should involve Rav Yonasan, just read the piece I quoted. It has nothing to do with Klausenberg at all. You never answered the fact that Rav Yonasan Steif was active in establishing an eruv for Manhattan and Williamsburg. I know what your revisionist mind is thinking – the derasha. However, there is a haskamah after this so called derasha were he clearly demonstrates that he supports these eruvin (see Kuntres Tikkun Eruvin Manhattan; there are also many other proofs).
Anon -
"yes he was his BIL he knew him well and he chased him out from his 'yeshiva' with a cane/stick! I heard this from many eye witness he dispised him."
I heard this tall tales many times. I think that someone should write a thesis on Stamar story telling. It’s a scholarly desideratum. It’s remarkable considering the fact that Rav Yoel did not believe any stories. I remember people citing this story to prove that the Klausenberger rebbe was crazy. I think it only proves that Rav Michoel Dov was a little mad. In any case, if there is any truth to this story (but I believe that it’s fiction) there was a family power struggle between the two of them.
קול השבת
646-862-2900
This hotline is proof of the revisions that I am referring to.
Its sickening to hear all these ghastly rumors which were spread by Satmar regarding the Klauzenburger z"l prewar private life. I know for a fact that his second marriage was of a very healthy nature. Many of these rumors were being fabricated by guys who the Klauzenburger z"l had to beg to put on Tefilin at the DP camps. Once they came to the US and switched parties, they tossed the Klauzbuger to the cleaners.
Don't get me wrong. The Satmar Ruv z"l was of a different league altogether. His caliber was a though one to compete with. But the Klauzenburger was a giant in his own right. A Gaon Betoireh,and a big Oved Hashem and yes, he was a very colorful character and rather unpredictable.
Anon
Just one simple question for all the Satmarer out there,
Is Reb Yoelish family feuds so clean that they afford to besmirch the Klausenburger ruv?
Was the Sasover his SIL? or the Sigeter his nephew?
I can't believe that there are still Satmar that are rumor mongering.
Anon
"The Satmar Ruv z"l was of a different league altogether"
Different in what???????
Anon
The Satmar Rov Zt"l was considered in a different league by The Chazon Ish, The Brisker Rov, The Tchbiner Rov, Reb A Kotler,Reb Y Hutner,and by (almost)every Tom,Dick and Harry.
Anon
"The Chazon Ish, The Brisker Rov, The Tchbiner Rov, Reb A Kotler,Reb Y Hutner"
because they spoke to him?
"Is Reb Yoelish family feuds so clean that they afford to besmirch the Klausenburger ruv?"
yes the klusher was his Nephew
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