Sunday, January 19, 2014

אוי וויי, אוי וויי, נוסח ווארקי

61 comments:

Otvotzk the original said...

This is a דרך in עבודת ה' that is actually attainable! With a rebbe lower than ten tefachim.

Thank you so much for posting this very inspiring song.

Truth seeker said...

Bang your head in the wall and become a vorka chasid? What is that?

Yanover said...

Vorka was the best.

The mashul given is like this:

There are two carriages going to town. The one on the right, sure it is going to town, but before you get on, you must make a commitment that you stay on the wagon until we reach the town, and you won't fall off the wagon. If you fall off the wagon, they will not stop and wait for you to get back on.

The carriage on the left is also headed to town. It is taking the same route as the first carriage. However, this carriage doesnt ask any commitments from you, and if you fall off, they will help you back on, and we will make it to town together.

The first wagon is Kotzk, and the second is Vorki.

Airmont said...

Hirshel are you insinuating that you or anash should try chagas instead of cots?

Hirshel Tzig - הירשל ציג said...

BEEN THERE DONE THAT

Anonymous said...

Been WHERE done WHAT

Hirshel Tzig - הירשל ציג said...

חג"ת

Soslivitzer said...

Spinka is qualified as חג"ת? Or did you try the rainbow of דרכי העבודה before crossing over to the dark side?

Hirshel Tzig - הירשל ציג said...

Spinka is חב"ד שבחג"ת

I also tried other ChaGaS

Soslivitzer said...

Getting interesting. Care to elaborate? Pretty please.

Shmeryl Tzeitelbeitel said...

So theres ChaBa"D theres ChaGa"S... What chassidusn are NeHe"Y? Netzoch Yesoid Hoid? Why doesnt anyone talk about this? I demand to know! Why the Cover up?

Shmeryl Tzeitelbeitel said...

So theres ChaBa"D theres ChaGa"S... What chassidusn are NeHe"Y? Netzoch Yesoid Hoid? Why doesnt anyone talk about this? I demand to know! Why the Cover up?

Ben Eliezer said...

I recall once seeing in a teshura (in someone's home), which featured different interesting things in the kisvei Yad from Chabad rebbeim. One was in the Frierdiker Rebbe's ksav Yad kodesh. It went something along the lines of lo ra'isi chassidus vorko nizkar bsichos rabboseinu nesieinu.

Being less educated at the time, I consulted a senior respected mashpia. He said he hadn't heard anything 'negative' or at odds thru the doros - so it most probably was just in reply to someone's query if it was mentioned anywhere. And to that - the FR said that no it hadn't. Nothing more than that.

chapaqua said...

is there a vorka rebbe/chasidus today?

Hirshel Tzig - הירשל ציג said...

Amshinov is Vorka

Ben Eliezer said...

Just to make my previous comment clear: *AS* vorki, the FR hadn't seen documented.
But there definitely was a warm and close connection with the Amshinover dynasty per se and chabad Rebbeim.

Chappaqua said...

You tried it?

Fred said...

Can we get to more serious things: Who composed this song? Is it old, just redone? Who released this version?

Yanover said...

הניגון הזה לחן ומלים כ"ק מרן אדמו"ר רבי מרדכי מנחם זצוקללה"ה זי"ע הרבי הצעיר מווארקי.

As such this is not an Amshinover Niggun. The oldest son of R Yitzchok of Vorki became the Amshinover, and his second son R' Mordche Menachem became leader of Vorki chassidus. His talmidim then went to R' Dov Berysh of Biala and today they are primarily in Aleksander and Strykov. And that is where you can find this niggun.

This rendition was made by Avrohom Moshkewitz, a chossid of the Aleksander rebbe in Boro Park. However the rights to the album are in dispute, as R' Zingers group (boro park on 56th) didnt pay the studio, so the Bnei Brak rebbes brother Shneur Zalman Danziger in cleveland bought the rights to it and gave out CD's at his sons wedding, when he married the daughter of R' Gavriel Tzinner the Ntei Gavriel.

Yanover said...

There are Vorki Niggunem sung in Chabad. The chabad Ato Bechartanu is identical to the vorki one. Also the chabad "Hoidu LaHashem, Kitov, Kiliolam Chasdo.." on shabbos morning is Vorki, and is on Heichal negina, if you go down to section ניגונים שונים on the bottom, the second niggun is Vorki.

Also, Hava Negila tune was taken from Vorka/Aleksander as well, and is still sung in the Aleksander shul yemei naraim and yomtovim.

Yanover said...

The current yerusha for the vorka chassidus is R' Bunem Kalish, and he is a breslover today. He declined nessius. I just heard two days ago however that he might have just become the rebbe after being pressed or something, I just heard something in passing, I can find out tomorrow though.

Reb Meshel said...

so Because of a Vorke nigun, the whole world should turn Vorke.
Perek 26 in Tanya does not give the chizuk, we have a Nigun instead, Ribono Shel Oilem, with which idiots do we have to deal with?

Not a Harry said...

http://theantitzemach.blogspot.com/2006/03/blog-post_17.html?m=1

http://theantitzemach.blogspot.com/2006/03/what-i-learned-this-purim.html?m=1

Some people actually work and develop themselves to become who they are.

Who here doesn't come late to davenin shabbos morning and doesn't have a significantly longer shmome esre than during the week?..

Not a Harry said...

@yanover who is r bunim kalish and how is he a yoresh? Who tried making him a rebbe?

קשין גרים לישראל said...

Start learning Tanya instead of reading and get yourself a rebbe. Do yourself a favor.

Nah said...

The nigun is quite relevant to the current state of your life. Live with this nigun and you'll end up a true oved as stated in perek 26 and igeres hatshuva.

Ben Eliezer said...

Just curious, what does R. Danziger have in Cleveland? Is there a chassidishe kloiz there besides Chabad led by Hagaon Harav Chaikin)?

Soslivitzer said...

How many Alexander rebbes are there? Did R Berish of Biala leave a shalsheles?

Ben Eliezer said...

B'kesher to Alexander chassidus mentioned here --

I once scanned from the sefer Oros Rabboseinu (Alexander), where

1) the Alexander Rebbe of the time writes to the Minchas Elazar, that he heard that the MA obtained aletter from Rayatz, and wants to receive a copy of it. (According to their hash'ara, this was 5683, only the 3rd year of Rayatz's nesius)

The second letter, is one which the said Alexander Rebbe himself wrote to Rayatz.

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/1nxqlet07jpwvut/bl_2xCYSxX

David Ben Gee said...

Ben Lazer


"One was in the Frierdiker Rebbe's ksav Yad kodesh. It went something along the lines of lo ra'isi chassidus vorko nizkar bsichos rabboseinu nesieinu."

you are daydreaming no such letter no such manuscripts

Ufer Vueifer said...

Yanover
"so the Bnei Brak rebbes brother Shneur Zalman Danziger in cleveland "
why you dont title him at least as a Reb?
is there available the Cd that Hirshel promoted here?
Aleksander once a big Rebisteve in Poland with egos choked to the minimum. After the war left with noting, with some in Israel, and some Satmat/Alexender group in brooklyn,but they are cursed with Machlokas as the big leagues, sad sad. Now you have Burech vs. the Rebbe, the satan works on all gears

Yankel Shtiechel said...

Yanover
" Hava Negila tune was taken from Vorka/Aleksander as well, and is still sung in the Aleksander shul yemei naraim and yomtovim."
it was sung in Belz of yesterday and of today.
Hard to believe that Belz in Galicia was influenced by Vorka,

David Ben Gee said...

Nah
" Hava Negila tune was taken from Vorka/Aleksander as well, and is still sung in the Aleksander shul yemei naraim and yomtovim."
What do you think about the nigun Esen Est Zich ?

Joe said...

Now you have Burech vs. the Rebbe,

A new rebbe?

Anonymous said...

There is a Rebbe in Bnei Brak, R' Yisroel Yoir Danziger. He is the grandson of the Emunas Moshe, who the chassidim made Rebbe after the Holocaust, because the Aleksander Rebbe Akaydos Yitzchok was killed in the Holocaust in '41.

In 1989, Rabbi Zinger, the son of the AB"D of Aleksander and in-law of the Akeidas Yitzchok, who was a business man in NYC, retired and made himself a rebbe at insistence of his kids. He died a few months later. The chassidim went to him first actually, but at the time he decliened to rebuild alexander. SO they went to Yehuda moshe Tyberg in Jerusalem, who was related to the old alexander rebbes. The chasidim of R zinger are primarily balei tshuva and disgruntled chassidim who left the israeli branch, including Moshkowitz whose voice is in this album. His Uncle is actually the gabbai of the Israeli rebbes for decades.

SO today there is the one in Bnei Brak, and Zinger in Boro Park, who has a yeshiva on 45th and a shtibl on 56th. His group is very small compared to the Israeli alexander which has about 1000 people and shuls around the world.

a couple years ago the brother of the Israeli rebbe made himself rebbe in cleveland, but he has no chassidim and i guess he uses the title to make balei tshuvas in ohio. see aleksandershul.com for his thing.

I read in a jpost that zinger in boroparks brother made his own court - alexander-vorki. And thats the hak i hear in the mikvah.

SO the chassidim made the Israeli branch, and Yichus and money made the american branches.

Yankel Shtiechel said...

the (In)famous Lipa sings a Amshinover Shulem Aliechem, as little as I know this holy courts of Amshinov Vorke, It has all the whistles of these courts,
did you hear it?
is it the universal shulem alichem there?
I think I heard this nigun by one of the Amshinover rebbes kids chupah's

Yankel Shtiechel said...

anon
reading you, it smells like a paid PR writeup?
how much did you charge?

Ben Eliezer said...

I kid you not. It was in Eretz Yisroel when I saw it (and was takeh puzzled by it at the time) , and I can't remember whose teshura it was.

I later searched on otzar hachochma (as many teshuros are featured therein) - but nothing came up.(possibly because the words weren't again in the text, so the OCR may have not picked up the image. But then again, perhaps that particular teshura isn't up on there).

It was by a relative of mine (who didn't have too many teshuros, plus I can ask him to go thru those he has with dates prior to the year I was there, to alleviate some of the searching time).

If something comes up, I will iyh feature it here.

Ben Eliezer said...

Well, I found this, from R. Yudel Chitrik's reshimos devorim. Didn't look at the original sefer, but it's apparently from R. Gronem or one of his mashpiim. Not from rebbeim, and [at the time] that the FR wrote as above - this mayse may not have been known, or he was referring to actual "verter" from the Vorki rebbes which were not within Chabad rebbeim's writings.

Ben Eliezer said...

Oops, here:
http://www.hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=15797&hilite=4b48e351-201c-400f-992f-ab3d36c04042&st=%d7%95%d7%95%d7%90%d7%a8%d7%a7%d7%90

Not a Harry said...

Skver sings hava nagila too, and so does novominsk.

אוי said...

Looks like a full fledged pr war is going on in Wikipedia about who is or isn't a Alexander rebbe in bnei brak Boro Park Cleveland Antwerp

Not a Harry said...

The חידושי הרים said that the אהבת רעים of פרשיסחא remained in ווארקי. If these guys are fighting they've eliminated they're שייכות to ווארקי.

Ungarischer Naar said...

Not a Harry
"If these guys are fighting they've eliminated they're שייכות to ווארקי."
if Ger eliminates Iyun, then they eliminated his relation to the Chidushie Harim

not a harry said...

nu nu, ich her.

Belz or Telz? said...

What is the problem everyone has with Vorka and this song? How does it conflict with anthing in chabad?

Can anyone type out the words? I cant make out some of it, and my yiddish isnt so good to get everything from it.

Hirshel Tzig - הירשל ציג said...


http://azamramusic.bandcamp.com/album/the-chassidic-songs-of-vurka-and-amshinov

Wesley Hills Chabad Chossid said...

As a Chabad Chossid, I perceive this Niggun asa a Very Hartziger and Varmer Chassidishe Niggun! I guess this is a different take on 'Essen Essen'. The Chabad niggun wails at the fact that after so much eating and drinking, what will be of Davening and Learning?
The Vorki Niggun cries out that despite eating and drinking just he shouldn't forget about Hashem.

Anonymous said...

The hava nagilah tune is a Sadigerrer Nigun

Anonymous said...

היתכן סגייט עפעס נישט ביי מיר
נישט דאונלאודען און נישט שפילען
ס' דארף עפעס את תיקון
(נישט דער משקה טייפ)
דיין אלטער פריינד
באטשי הויזנטרעגער ס"ט

באאטשי said...

היתכן סגייט עפעס נישט ביי מיר
נישט דאונלאודען און נישט שפילען
ס' דארף עפעס את תיקון
(נישט דער משקה טייפ)
דיין אלטער פריינד
באטשי הויזנטרעגער ס"ט

Hirshel Tzig - הירשל ציג said...

באאטשי

שיק מיר אין אישי

Yermiye Dee said...

Anon
"The hava nagilah tune is a Sadigerrer Nigun"
How did it get to Belz?

Not a Telzer said...

The hock on wikipedia is geboit on a Ee-yedia of the matzav in Cleveland, or stam kina. Shneur Zalman Denciger opened a Beis Medrash in his home in Cleveland, he is very matzliach, and he is called the Rebbe, and firz-ech azoi vee an Admor. It's not tachas Nesius Achiv.

Anonymous said...

Anon
"The hava nagilah tune is a Sadigerrer Nigun"
How did it get to Belz?

maybe thru skver or viznitz? (family of the heilegeh rizhiner)

Vorka wanna be said...

It's still playing on repeat, the whole album is really a treasure.
Shkoyach

rabbi said...

The Aleksander Rebbe of Cleveland bought the rights for this CD from Yitzhak Shor who produced this CD, the Moskowitz mentioned in previous comments was paid to sing and has no rights neither does Rabbi Singer have any rights..

Anonymous said...

He has a nice shtibel and kollel

zalman said...

ANNOUNCEMENT- I'm reading a old discussion on this blog, and I have for you news, VORKA is a dynasty that still goes on in our days besides in amshinov and Alexander, Vorka is today still a warm place for every yid from high to low, like the previous rebbies of Vorka teached them, there are chabure's every single week in several places in new York, Lakewood N.J., London, Antwerp, and Jerusalem. They say they have over 100 families joining there way... Long live VORKA...

Shmeryl said...

Would you say these are the right words to the song?

גייט א איד אויף גלייכע שטיינער
פאלט אראפ און ציברעכט זיך די ביינער
ער וואלגערט זיך ארום יארן יארן
ביז ער קומט קיין ווארקע צו פארן


נישט געדאווענט, נישט געלערנט
נאר דעם בורא עולם נישט דערצערנט
יא געשלאפן, יא געגעסן,
נאר פון בורא עולם נישט פארגעסן.

Hirshel Tzig - הירשל ציג said...

Yes, Shmeryl