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Anti the Litvishe Derech Halimud
22 comments:
That article is so true though.
I saw in the Sefer Hallu Avdie Hashem of reb Moshe Arye Freund the Rav of the Ungarishe Hiezer.,
That he asked the Sakmar Ruv if he can change his yeshiva to the litvishe derech halimud.. since inYerushaliem this old ungarishe style was considered outdated,
The Sakmar ruv stopped him by saying Ich ken Dos Nisht Lieden, he was very primitive to listen to a new concept that he did not hear of in Krolle...
ר' יונה: ילפותות אין לימודים פון פּסוקים,
לראי',ראיתי בספרי חסידות, תנא אקראי קאי דהיינו העיקר הוא אקראי הפּסוקים
I had the opportunity to hear from
שני עדים נאמנים שהרב"י זצ"ל אמר: הוא מאוד מסופק אם צריכים לומר ברכה"ת למי שלומד בזה הדרך הלימוד
תנא קמא
If you have some respect for the Rav of Satmar, you would not publicize this nonsense.. it is the derech halimud of Klal Yisroel.. his own yeshivah in Queens of the segment that claimed to be his real mamshichie darkoim, changed to that style...
Nobody will learn a blatt gemora divrie yoel style...
Tibi Lotzi: " his own yeshivah in Queens of the segment that claimed to be his real mamshichie darkoim, changed to that style" NO KIDDING!
?הרוצה לשקר ירחיק עדותו
The SR passed away in 1979 that's 33 years ago Why are you claiming his own yeshivah, more than the yeshiva cofetz chaim in N.J. somewhere, is the cofetz chaim's yeshivah?
"Nobody will learn a blatt gemora divrie yoel style" I heard this nonsense 50 years ago,
I understand that:
באתרא דיצה"ר לית דמנכרי יצ"ט
But still todays world clings to his word pro or con?! more than anytime before and it's viral and always will be ...
נצח ישראל לא ישקר
Nothing to be shamed of Lotzi!
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ps: Lee ave cor. hewes st. had a candy store owned by two old hugarian bachleours Tibi and Lotzi, are you related?
ps: Lee ave cor. hewes st. had a candy store owned by two old hugarian bachleours Tibi and Lotzi, are you related?
Related... sure I loved their danishes...
Tibi Lotzi: "If you have some respect for the Rav of Satmar, you would not publicize this"
תורה היא וללמוד אני צריך
ps: I know a lotzi when I see one! but what's a Tibi? ok yea מעשה טבי עבדי, שהי' תלמיד חכמים But he wasn't jewish right?
"The SR passed away in 1979 that's 33 years ago Why are you claiming his own yeshivah, more than the yeshiva cofetz chaim in N.J. somewhere, is the cofetz chaim's yeshivah? "
The chofetz chaim had no derech halimud, It was the shemiras Haloshen campaign that he promoted constantly, it would be a oxymoron if the yeshiva Cc would print a Pashkevil
TibiLotzi "The chofetz chaim had no derech halimud,"
Actually he did!, so did ר' חיים ז"ל But the haskalah of the time took many talmidim away from yeshivas or send them to hildensheimer/hirsch type yeshivas, to prevent that ר' חיים ז"ל came up with this concoction! Which is based on logic the core to college studies and made it into a new דרך הלימוד
BTW reb MB Weissmandel wanted to get into the chofetz chaim's yeshivah and he advised not to claiming that the דרך הלימוד is now in hungary!
TibiLotzi: "it would be a oxymoron if the yeshiva Cc would print a Pashkevil"
It was actually the אנשי ווילנא who where masters in printing Pashkeviln than carried of to the eida אנשי י-ם
Correct, but did the CC agree to the Anshie Vilna?
He quotes the RAV probably 100's of time in his Mishneh Berura,
ער האט געדארפט צוענדיקן, מה שאין כן אין חידושי סוגיות און אין ויואל משה איז א שכל הישר בלי שום מקורות זרים און דעריבער קען מען זיך אויף זיי פארלאזען הלכה למעשה
Tomshover: "Correct, but did the CC agree to the Anshie Vilna?
He quotes the RAV probably 100's of time in his Mishneh Berura,"
Yes he does when the litvakshe shita was over!, Would he of do it בימי הגר"א ?
Ende Tsadik said:
ער האט געדארפט צוענדיקן, מה שאין כן אין חידושי סוגיות און אין ויואל משה איז א שכל הישר בלי שום מקורות זרים און דעריבער קען מען זיך אויף זיי פארלאזען הלכה למעשה
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ריכטיג!, ער האט גימיינט אז די ווייסט וואס יעדעס קינד ווייסט
ויואל משה נוטריקון: א'נכי ו'לא י'הי ל'ך מ'פּי ה'גבורה שׁ'מענו
Stropkover
"Yes he does when the litvakshe shita was over!, Would he of do it בימי הגר"א ?"
its hypotetical talk, but you see that the yesoid veshoresh avoda was in the era of the Cherem and was friendly towards chasidim.
Plus I saw lately in s sefer of the FIL of the CC, that he quotes the Berdichever Ruv, so the family were not in the hate business
Petach: " so the family were not in the hate business"
!נחמתנו
Although He is considered from the ליטווישע חדר
יעלזו חסידים בכבוד
I had to rub my eyes. He nixed a shidduch because of the derech halimud??!! What does that have to do with a shiduch? In two years he is going to work for B&H (or its predecessors) anyway. This sounds like a bais hatalmuder who could think that if you do not have the derech halimud of theirs you may be a wifebeater!!!
yankel: "This sounds like a bais hatalmuder who could think that if you do not have the derech halimud of theirs you may be a wifebeater!!!"
סברא כרסיות Indeed, which yeshivah did 'you learn'?
yankel: "I had to rub my eyes. He nixed a shidduch because of the derech halimud??!!"
Dear Yankele, The moral of the story has nothing to do with a failed derech halimud, ר' שלמה מנשה פאלקאוויטש ע"ה was a talmid of SR and a melamdim in satmar, his father before WWII was from the זקני ת"ח וחסידים from SR! his granfather was a גיוויגטער סיגוטער חסיד His whole family perished in WWII Like most re-settlers after in similar situations, They all not only clung to SR for a "derech halimud" But he became their father (and rebbe) in the full sense of the word Just like you know that 'father knows best' so did they!!! Which the SR z"l fully excepted 24/7 365 days a year he listened to them he bhought them up, in many many cases trained them employed them put them into business and gave them advise not like a rebbe only But more so like a real father!!! מרא דעלמא כולא! If that can be twisted as a negative What is positive?!
Dont worry about the nixed shidduch they both got married and lived happily after, perhaps 'like u and me' To understand that and to put it in the above context that even little yankele can understand it for that you need to read מש"י ע"י רש"י
אל תירא יענקע'לע כי קטן אתה, אתך אני... כי הנני מושיעך מרחוק
כי תלך באש לא תכוה ולהבה לא תבער בך, כי אני ד' א' קדוש ישראל מושיעך
Stropkover
after all the Satmar ruv still comes across as primitive and like a Dorfs Ruv ( as he called once the Krasner ruv) you are correct that Falkawitz is his homeboy and ready to do anything for him.. but his mimicking Brisk with the table metaphor is juvenile at its best..
The should not have been printed in 2012
You seem to have understod my comment as a question as to why the Satmar Rov mixed into his business by nixing the shiduch. I understand that it was the SR's business to decide who his daughter should marry. I don't understand why the failed derech halimud makes a difference in married life. Who cares why a table is a table? As long as he provides for her and does not beat her, he can continue for many years wondering why a cup of tea is sweet. It seemed he was attaching undue importance to derech halimud because he wanted to make a point, which was why I had to rub my eyes.
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