Oiberlanders have mostly become Hassidified over time. I'm only challenging the part of "bichlal nisht Chassidish", not the validity of what's being said.
Hirshel, do you anything about Rav Ettinger, talmid muvhok of the Alter Rebbe? I read somewhere that he was accepted by the Misnagdim in Bobruisk as their rov despite his being Lubavitch due to the fact that he was a tremendous talmid chochem. I just found out last night from the Bobruisker sefer yizkor that despite my zayde telling us we were always misnagdim, a branch of our mishpocho was meshadech with Rav Ettinger.
Litvak "Oiberlanders have mostly become Hassidified over time. I'm only challenging the part of "bichlal nisht Chassidis" nobody will ever tell you that the Maharam Shick was a chosid,in his later years he was friendly with the Yetev Lev of Sighet... but he was no chosid what so ever. At the same time its worthy to note a hesped that he writes on the first Tosher Rebbe, in the Hesped he describes some Moffes of his. I never saw it quoted in any biographies in both of this gedolim...
Shkoyich Hirshel. Very interesting that Rav Ettinger used to speak in learning with the Gra and upon leaving Vilna, discovered that the yeshiva in Slutzk did not hold of the cherem against Chasidim. He later gravitated to the baal Seder Hadoros in Minsk, the city where it seems the biggest lamdonim of Chabad were located.
I do take issue however with the slant in this sefer. They are saying that there is no more rov in Vilna from then on due to a machlokes among Misnagdim, not because no one could fill the shoes of the Vilna Gaon which is the real reason.
Litvak "I do take issue however with the slant in this sefer. They are saying that there is no more rov in Vilna from then on due to a machlokes among Misnagdim, not because no one could fill the shoes of the Vilna Gaon which is the real reason." please refresh your history lessons, the Gra was not the Rav in Vilna.. in the Gra's days their was a big fight with the Avad hoAchron,, no relation with the Gra.... the city got fed up and no Rav was was ever crowned after that...
Yes but even though R' Shmuel ben Avigdor was the last rov, the Vilna Gaon was part of the cheshbon, or at least that's what rebbeim in yeshivos say over.
Interestingly enough, Rav Ettinger not only became an eidim by such a Misnagid, R' Shmuel, but his widowed mother married him. She was the daughter of the Lemberger Rov
The original Schmerling from the chocolate & cheese maker in Schweiz was also a chossid of the alter Rebbe. He moved to Schweiz in those days from Russland. The ainiklach moved away from Lubavitch, even going to learn in Ponivizh but have been coming back. The Chabad shaliach today in Far Rockaway is the latest generation of Schmerling.
Since we are into Mispachalogia (genealogy) I would like to add that the Mahram Shick was from the same Shick family of shklov... 1 son of the famous family became a chosid of the Alter Rebbe
Tomoshov, I thought I already heard all the yeshivish-yinglish make up words. "Mishpochologia" is a new one (& pretty funny!)
There were always silly chevra in yeshiva trying to outdo each other like this: "hamburger mit tomatchia", "fuftzig bucks a monthski"
Then there was the rov who was maspid the alter Slabodker, Rav Ruderman, "vos er hot gehat a zikaron 'photogenistchia'"
It gets annoying when you have nuts who davka want everyone to think they are even more metzumtzemdik and ignorant than they actually are. Moishe Scheinerman once told a standing room only crowd about one of his many retarded manufactured shaylos that he bothered Rav Elyashev with. This one involved fake pepperoni pizza which he purposely mispronounced as "papparazzi" mit a yeshivishe Rrraish, hoping everyone would quickly correct him, which they did. And there was a lunatic Hungarian Brisker who referred to mesquite bbq potato chips as "mosquito". They actually think it makes them more yeshivish to talk like hillbillies.
There were also Ettingers who ended up in the Unterland. They were probably not related to the rabbonishe family. They probably just originated 100s of years earlier in the city of Oetinga
A Romanisher Ettinger showed up in Cleveland in 1885 claiming to be a rov and was given a shteller in the Anshei Emess shul. He chased after a Hungarian girl named Rosenberg and got engaged to her. When the shul found out he had a wife already back home in Romania, they tried to get rid of him. He then produced a shtar signed by a rov in the alter heim that his wife died. They determined it was mezuyef.
after reading the Mharam shick dilligently, I think I see some kefira in his words, he writes that a guf is housing the spark of godliness... is this the chabad kefira? I believe that we will have to say the usual cliche Talmid Toye Kosvoi... or we need some misnagedic philosopher to explain it, I think we will have to wait awhile they are busy deciding who is the nosi hador of the newspapers, Shtieman vs.Auerbach...
Another blooper from Rabbi Scheinerman was probably real ignorance. He blurted out an example of a city and said Corpus Christi. I am assuming he doesn't know what it means in Latin.
And what has got to be the funniest example of all was when he prepared for a shiur in arbah minim, he researched the Latin names of the various palm species which he presented to the oylam. He did not have the names klor and when he confused them he did not count on someone sitting in the shiur who could correct him. This fellow was a tropical horticulturist from UCLA, one of only two schools in the United States that even offers that major. If you know Rabbi Scheinerman, imagine what happened when he was corrected from this Phd who was not the type to cower.
That shul in Cleveland which started in 1857, had a strange history. After Ettinger they hired a rov who learned in Telz in Lita but became a Tzioni. Then they hired Solomon Goldman in the 1920s, a closet Reconstructionist who led them to the Conservative movement. They were for many years the largest Conservative temple in America and still exist.
24 comments:
its shocking to come out from one of the pillars of the tielung...which is the holiest the holiest mitzva in willi...
Tibi'ko, don't be a lotzi.
You have to love every Jew, but don't be his best friend. There is a difference, No?
I don't see the teilung as a stirah at all. The teilung was to get recognition, not to make the Neologues אויס אידן
רבי ישעי'לי קערעסטירער יוכיח
Budaash
"but don't be his best friend. There is a difference, No"
can you translate Ahava....
I don't see the litvaks as a stirah at all. The teilung betwenn chasidim and misnagdim was to get recognition, not to make the Litvakim אויס אידן
יט כסליו יוכיח
chabad has not found anyone new to hate since 200 years ago
Oiberlanders have mostly become Hassidified over time. I'm only challenging the part of "bichlal nisht Chassidish", not the validity of what's being said.
Hirshel, do you anything about Rav Ettinger, talmid muvhok of the Alter Rebbe? I read somewhere that he was accepted by the Misnagdim in Bobruisk as their rov despite his being Lubavitch due to the fact that he was a tremendous talmid chochem. I just found out last night from the Bobruisker sefer yizkor that despite my zayde telling us we were always misnagdim, a branch of our mishpocho was meshadech with Rav Ettinger.
Litvak
"Oiberlanders have mostly become Hassidified over time. I'm only challenging the part of "bichlal nisht Chassidis"
nobody will ever tell you that the Maharam Shick was a chosid,in his later years he was friendly with the Yetev Lev of Sighet... but he was no chosid what so ever.
At the same time its worthy to note a hesped that he writes on the first Tosher Rebbe, in the Hesped he describes some Moffes of his. I never saw it quoted in any biographies in both of this gedolim...
Litvak
"do you anything about Rav Ettinger, talmid muvhok of the Alter Rebbe?"
is he on the list in Bies Rebbe?
רבי ברוך מרדכי עטטינגער
See Here
He has grandkids in Israel, big Litvaks.
עלה בשנת תרי"א לארץ ישראל, והתיישב בירושלים. נפטר ב-י"ד באלול תרי"ב ונקבר בהר הזיתים סמוך לקברו של אור החיים.
תולדות ברוך מרדכי
Shkoyich Hirshel. Very interesting that Rav Ettinger used to speak in learning with the Gra and upon leaving Vilna, discovered that the yeshiva in Slutzk did not hold of the cherem against Chasidim. He later gravitated to the baal Seder Hadoros in Minsk, the city where it seems the biggest lamdonim of Chabad were located.
I do take issue however with the slant in this sefer. They are saying that there is no more rov in Vilna from then on due to a machlokes among Misnagdim, not because no one could fill the shoes of the Vilna Gaon which is the real reason.
Litvak
"I do take issue however with the slant in this sefer. They are saying that there is no more rov in Vilna from then on due to a machlokes among Misnagdim, not because no one could fill the shoes of the Vilna Gaon which is the real reason."
please refresh your history lessons, the Gra was not the Rav in Vilna.. in the Gra's days their was a big fight with the Avad hoAchron,, no relation with the Gra.... the city got fed up and no Rav was was ever crowned after that...
Yes but even though R' Shmuel ben Avigdor was the last rov, the Vilna Gaon was part of the cheshbon, or at least that's what rebbeim in yeshivos say over.
Interestingly enough, Rav Ettinger not only became an eidim by such a Misnagid, R' Shmuel, but his widowed mother married him. She was the daughter of the Lemberger Rov
The original Schmerling from the chocolate & cheese maker in Schweiz was also a chossid of the alter Rebbe. He moved to Schweiz in those days from Russland. The ainiklach moved away from Lubavitch, even going to learn in Ponivizh but have been coming back. The Chabad shaliach today in Far Rockaway is the latest generation of Schmerling.
Since we are into Mispachalogia (genealogy) I would like to add that the Mahram Shick was from the same Shick family of shklov... 1 son of the famous family became a chosid of the Alter Rebbe
Tomoshov, I thought I already heard all the yeshivish-yinglish make up words. "Mishpochologia" is a new one (& pretty funny!)
There were always silly chevra in yeshiva trying to outdo each other like this: "hamburger mit tomatchia", "fuftzig bucks a monthski"
Then there was the rov who was maspid the alter Slabodker, Rav Ruderman, "vos er hot gehat a zikaron 'photogenistchia'"
It gets annoying when you have nuts who davka want everyone to think they are even more metzumtzemdik and ignorant than they actually are. Moishe Scheinerman once told a standing room only crowd about one of his many retarded manufactured shaylos that he bothered Rav Elyashev with. This one involved fake pepperoni pizza which he purposely mispronounced as "papparazzi" mit a yeshivishe Rrraish, hoping everyone would quickly correct him, which they did. And there was a lunatic Hungarian Brisker who referred to mesquite bbq potato chips as "mosquito". They actually think it makes them more yeshivish to talk like hillbillies.
There were also Ettingers who ended up in the Unterland. They were probably not related to the rabbonishe family. They probably just originated 100s of years earlier in the city of Oetinga
http://query.nytimes.com/mem/archive-free/pdf?res=F3071EFF3E5B10738DDDAC0994D0405B8584F0D3
A Romanisher Ettinger showed up in Cleveland in 1885 claiming to be a rov and was given a shteller in the Anshei Emess shul. He chased after a Hungarian girl named Rosenberg and got engaged to her. When the shul found out he had a wife already back home in Romania, they tried to get rid of him. He then produced a shtar signed by a rov in the alter heim that his wife died. They determined it was mezuyef.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chabad-Lubavitch_related_controversies
Well the Tzig has claimed that he is fighting all chabad bashing online that's so prevalent according to him.
The guy is paranoid
after reading the Mharam shick dilligently, I think I see some kefira in his words, he writes that a guf is housing the spark of godliness... is this the chabad kefira?
I believe that we will have to say the usual cliche Talmid Toye Kosvoi... or we need some misnagedic philosopher to explain it, I think we will have to wait awhile they are busy deciding who is the nosi hador of the newspapers, Shtieman vs.Auerbach...
Another blooper from Rabbi Scheinerman was probably real ignorance. He blurted out an example of a city and said Corpus Christi. I am assuming he doesn't know what it means in Latin.
And what has got to be the funniest example of all was when he prepared for a shiur in arbah minim, he researched the Latin names of the various palm species which he presented to the oylam. He did not have the names klor and when he confused them he did not count on someone sitting in the shiur who could correct him. This fellow was a tropical horticulturist from UCLA, one of only two schools in the United States that even offers that major. If you know Rabbi Scheinerman, imagine what happened when he was corrected from this Phd who was not the type to cower.
That shul in Cleveland which started in 1857, had a strange history. After Ettinger they hired a rov who learned in Telz in Lita but became a Tzioni. Then they hired Solomon Goldman in the 1920s, a closet Reconstructionist who led them to the Conservative movement. They were for many years the largest Conservative temple in America and still exist.
Post a Comment