Friday, February 25, 2011

לשיטתך - מיר פארשטייען בעסער

נגד חוברת ''אור הצפון'' מבעלזא


Satmar has always "suffered" from this affliction; they always knew what the other guys need to do based on what HIS seforim say. Like I was told recently in a comment, that I should "l'shitoscho" when arguing a point, and that Satmar does it very well. They tell the Lubavitchers what the Rebbe Rashab wrote, and the Belzer what the Rebbe Reb Soocher Dov held. The SatmarRov tried to convince his son, The Holy Reb Ahron Belzer that he wasn't acting in accordance with what "Belz" had opined pre-WW2. Recently the Belzer אור הצפון publication has irked the Satmarer more than usual, and they decided to take action and attack. They used their "big dog," Menashe Fulop, who they all loved when they were all one team, but npw that he's on the "Zali" side has very few admirers left. The circular and irrelevant arguments and logic used here should be made into a case study of how NOT to argue an issue, question like "ווי קען מען זאגן אזא זאך אויף דער הייליגער רבי ישכר דוב?" and others like that don't win arguments in the face of facts on the ground, but that doesn't keep them from "keeping on keeping on."

All because "זיי פארשטייען בעסער"

23 comments:

Anonymous said...

The irony is that he starts out his Eideh article, with the infamous Satmar belief, that all stories are not true, since it is being used for Ahavas Yisroel, But he forgets that all his articles consists, is not more then sipurim on sipurim, from Feferkorn to Tietelbaum printed in the sipurim collection of Siach Zekanim by 80 year old people.

Anonymous said...

He is asking how come the Belzer Ruv said this and this in Toov Raish Pie Ches, and today he his saying different,
It is like asking a Ruv, how come you let your people touch Muktza on a weekday, I heard you saying Toov Shien Pei Tzadik that it is osser.
It is simple, he realized after the war, that things changed,their was a holocaust and a country was built, and thats why Hashem left him alive with miracles, to change the path of Charadie Judaism regarding their non religious brothers.And as we all see that this path built up a massive yidishkiet in Israel, that has no precedence since the Churban.

Anonymous said...

WHATS WRONG ???

The whole TENACH is full of "Divrei Toichuchu" why we r difrent then our Parents used to b

y Shouldnt a argument go like this ?

Anonymous said...

The average Satmarer Chosid today could not give two hoots about the Medina and Zionisim. They are up to the neck in their own @#@# with the two brothers fighting like dogs in and out of secular Courts, and they have got the nerve to come and dismiss what the holy Belzer Rov Zua said.

Anonymous said...

They dont relize what a mess they have done with this article. Basicley the logic they use is A. The Belzer Rov RYD was a fierey Kanoi B. The Belzer Rov RA whould never have done anything that does not work with the policy of his holy father. So one and one and the krepel Toreh concludes that all the OH letters are false!! (typical ingrashier way of thinking).

But the Belzer Rov supported the voting for the Kenesset. So according to the above pilpul that is proof that the RYD whould have done the same!! What a own goal!

Anonymous said...

But saying Lietzunas on Gedolie hador, with a facade of Mussar is Kefira according to the Rambam.
If all the Gedolim that were the Marbitzei torah veYirah in Eretz Yisroel, took a certain stand that had succeded much more then any optimist could have imagine.Then the am Heoretz and forger, who comes and criticises it, is in the criteria on Malhivin Bemalaachie Elokim, as the Rambam writes in his Yad. And then if he will say that it is all the Sitra Achra he is glatt a Kofer in Hashgoche Peroties.

Anonymous said...

I heard that Teller from Der Blatt also wrote against the Ohr Hatzofen

chossidlite said...

Tzig is there any place online where I could read the ohr hatzofon

Hirshel Tzig - הירשל ציג said...

chossidlite

I tried to upload it on another site but the file got corrupted

send me your email address and I'll send you a copy

We Want Belz Blog Now said...

Tziyoinus is to Satmar what Tziyonus is to Egypt, Tunisia, Libya, etc.
Voos mein Ich tzi zugen?
A convenient Soineh fin der vatens, fin tzat tzi tzat darf men geben a shtois, oder a Shelt, as a distraction, rallying cry, or Stam Un'Tzi'Schrofen dem Oilem

grainom said...

please send me the OH too.
thanks
grainom@gmail.com

Holy Belz Empire said...

We Want Belz Blog Now said...

belzempire.blogspot.com

belzempire@gmail.com

bobov chusid said...

THE BELZ PEOPLE WHO DO POSSES EMAIL CAME OUT OF THE WOODWORK TO RESPOND BRUTALY AGAINST THIS.

belz changed this is fact, so dont go around selling "kedushes belz". belz is a small village were people lived and did all there "earthly" stuff within the borders of this village.

this town also had a rebbi that build a shul, so its basicly "kedushes belz shul", but indeed every shul is holy.

belz hoif said...

belz banned pictures, most pictures were taken in maribad, is it a must these days?

belz banned a clean coat, is it a must these days to go clean?

Belz Blog w Toichen said...

belzempire.blogspot.com "sucks" Bla"z.
You have to take time to put in Toichen, dont be such a Un"ge'Blooz'ene Galitziyaner, that the world should coming running to you

Anonymous said...

Belz Hoif
"belz banned pictures, "
FYI, Reb Chaim Chloma Friedman writes in his sefer Betzila, that Reb Sucher Dov changed his view regarding pictures,he was more positive about it. Since by Klal Yisroel it became a fact of life.Adding that by Chasidim they had the general rule that if Klal Yisroel will be in Gehinom I want to be there with them too, I dont want yo be myself in Gan Eden.
Eventough you will see in all the anti pictures pamphlet, they quote some story of Reb Shulem Belzer being adamant against pictures. But his Einikel changed course,it also tells you about the situation in the state of Israel, that Hashkafa is not Halacha and it should be changed according to the needs.
BTW, Friedman was from the old school, and no chosid of the current Rebbe

Anonymous said...

R' Hirshel --
I know this is somewhat the wrong thread, but I just came across your (old) comment on the Pirsum Rishon blog re R' Volf's expression of "chanifos".

I can't recall the exact loshon, but Rabbi SB Chaiken (a talmid of R' Volf, and a dayken) was giving a Taharas Hamishpacha shiur in crown heights about 2 months ago. As an aside, he wished to clarify that this wording, which was subsequently published in the Kfar Chabad was off, and he rectified the loshon he'd heard from RV, which fit much better with the Rebbe's shprach (instead of the various magzimim of heint, just to make headlines, bitui bilti ragil etc..

They didn't make an audio of the class, but there may be others here who wrote the loshon down..

Anonymous said...

can you please send me the or hatzfon so i can see the other side of the penny
thanks
esrog2009@gmail.com

Anonymous said...

some things are not tzi farshtein , the belz -satmar machloike iz gegangen shlufen when the bnei yoel zennen tzi shtand gekimen ,the energy what was used against belz was now flying within satmar ,belz did'nt gloat ,fight is over ,bye za gezint ,endlich satmar is split in 2 ,redden zich ahn di chevra that the good old days of belz bashing is back typical senseless ungarishe bullying ,the fact is that the ahroinim are moving to the left , zaloinim are for anyone who hates aaron,and belz are out of the picture. satmar wishes to be mechadesh the machloike but it aint gonna happen ,they had their chance with spinka ,kruly,etc but belz is wishfull thinking

Holy Belz Empire said...

Agreed that Holy Belz Empire "sucks" b'laz.

Holy Belz Empire said...

Seriously, if anyone has something to say or to leak.
belzempire@gmail.com
It was opened as a collaborative forum.

shmuel grainom said...

i had wanted the or hatzafun, if you can send it over i would be most aspreciative.

the kneged, is duch satmer...

UD said...

Tzig,

Did you actually have a point here ? Your "argument" is no less circular ; you don't actually disagree that both RY"D and Rashab were basically ignored and their viewpoints twisted, forgotten and abandoned by those who came afterwards. I might have had a hard time choosing between the crusty moldy pus of Mr. Toib's extrusion versus Jabba the Hutt's yevsektsiya and unabashed sucking of the poisoned tit of the Entity, and here you come guns blazing being makhria in favor of Der Yid of all things. Perhaps you want to assemble some sort of logical chain of thought when making a point ...