Thursday, November 26, 2009
רבי שמשון חאריטאנאוו ז"ל
There was a Yid in Crown Heights named Reb Shamshon Charitinov. He passed away last night, on the YomHoledes/Yohrtzeit of the Mitteler Rebbe. I was actually his neighbor for several years, but I don't think I ever said more than "ah gut morgen" to him. I had other such neighbors, elderly chassidim; I should've mustered the courage to speak to these Yidden. Reb Shamshon did not merit to have what you can call an easy life. His father - Reb Sholem - died when he was a young bachur, he grew up under Soviet rule living with constant mesiras nefesh, and - I assume make the long journey to Uzbekistan during the War. After arriving in New York after WW2 RSC worked very hard for his daily bread. You may have never heard of him were it not for the Neginah that he produced, rather sang, from his ancestors, some of the most beautiful neginah ever composed, IIMSSM. Neginah that takes you from the mundane on a cold and rainy Monday morning and scrubs your soul clean with tears of loving Tshuveh. Quite literally. If you are not or were not inspired by his singing then you need to examine yourself very closely, because a man with soul NEEDS to be inspired by something as G-dly as that. If he isn't then his "receptacles" may not be working at full capacity.
In Crown Heights today the eynikel Reb Sholem Charitinov is one of Chabad's true gems. A durchgeveikte chassidishe yid whose home is always open to any and all visitors, "Sholem" is where many a bocher got his first Shabbos in Crown Heights with the Rebbe. I too benefited from their hospitality, as well as my kids. The one thing he may not have yarshened is the singing voice, but he makes up for it in his hafotzas HaChassides among a cross spectrum of Jews. The same goes for his choshuv'e Rebbetzin, who puts many a chassidisher yungerman to shame with her broad knowledge. They both would be terribly embarrassed if they knew I was speaking about them here, but I feel it's necessary. The world must know of such gems, of the kiddush hashem that they perpetuate with their good deeds. That's part of what we do here at the Tent; we try and be mekadesh shem hashem to those who may not know about G-d. I believe I've been somewhat successful here, despite all the attacks. May Reb Shamshon be a maylitz yosher for all of us, and may we hear his sweet melodies, yachad im kol bnei mishpachas Charitonov LeDoroseyhem, b'vias Moshiach Tzidkeinu Taikef U'Miyad Mamesh!
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Boruch Dayan Emes
How did you manage to mangle the post up so terribly?
Especially the last half when you talk about the son and yourself.
What is the following about:"That's part of what we do here at the Tent; we try and be mekadesh shem hashem to those who may not know about G-d."
Wow! (and I thought you were actually promoting the rebbe and Lubavitch....I guess it's the same thing for you)
what's the matter, bubbele, you have a tummy ache? too much turkey for you?
I've noticed that when you write on a parev non Lubavitch subject you can make some sense in your writing.Sometimes it's even readable.When there is a Lubavitch connection you become infantile and immature.A regression to when you joined them?
About R'S Charitanov whom I met in the sukka set up by the simchas beis hashoeivo in Crown Heights:There were signs about the sukka ,I came in there and was invited in by a heimishe yingerman with peyos and shtreimel who spoke a heimishe yiddish, R'Sholom made the impression of someone who is truly areingeton in torah with no other interests and was being used as bait to "chap" people to Lubavitch.So it was a seemingly non threatening hemishe yingerman and a gehoibenh yid like R'Sholom who was being used.I'm sure R'Sholom is a tayereh yid but I suspect he is a Meshichist, he is after all mashpia in Oholei Torah a nest of the Meshichism and iirc quoted and interviewed often in Bais Moshiach, the meshichist mag where the rebbe is "shlit'a leolom voed"
so let me get this straight; Lubavitch only made me infantile when it comes to Lubavitch subjects? It allowed me to think clearly when it comes to other topics? How's that? and what kind of a "job" did they do on me if that's the case?
What I meant is very simple.You have kids, leorech yomim tovim,right?
Did you ever notice that your son for example can be very mature about certain things but regress to half his age when some other buttons in psyche are touched?
Your ability to think clearly about non Lubav issues has nothing to do with Lubavitch,people are multi faceted and that part of your personality developed normally.
Lubavitch of today can be very childish.Small example?I was invited by a relative to the hachnosas sefer torah lezecher the kedoshim in Mumbai at 770.The rebbe was honored with two pesukim from "ata horeiso" and the first "hakofo".This was done very fervently and loudly on the powerful microphone in front of thousands.The people running this were "shpitz,non meshichist, Chabad"
Is it kefira? Of course not.Is it very,very childish.Yup!But these same guys being mechabed the rebbe for a kovod he unfortunately cannot get for the last 15 years are prolific fundraisers and good managers.
ah, yes, aren't we all like that.
Many people are NOT like that.Especially people that we want to look up to.
There is something wrong when adults get stuck in a certain phase.
Lubavitch in general is stuck at a pre the rebbes passing stage and is not doing well psychologically.The worst part is that they don't know it and therefore are not open to healing
then again we believe that our zeides come to the Mitzvah tantz of their eyniklach
we believe that a chicken over our head will die instead of us
and the list goes on...
I know you don't consider these beliefs on the same level, but you get the point
besides, I believe it was the Rebbe that was mechabed the FR with certain kibbudim after HIS passing. Not forever, but still.
Zev Katz, the Gabbai at the HST is a reasonable man, you can ask him.
"besides, I believe it was the Rebbe that was mechabed the FR with certain kibbudim after HIS passing. Not forever, but still."
You have touched the "problem"
not VeDal, ye of little faith.
Please shutup and stop hocking a chainik about inyanim you don't know the first thing about.
What "inyanim" do you refer to?
let me explain,
whatever the rebbe wanted the kelbelach to think of himself he said about his shver the FR. he was very matzliach in imparting that lesson. so don't have taines on the things you see that you don't like.
I was told by a friend of the einekel that his Heligness was in Ir HaOKdesh and I can ask him any question in chassidus. I said my greeting and asked and he stared forward and did not reply at all.
No he was not davening.
"we believe that a chicken over our head will die instead of us"
You sound very undeveloped.
I notice that you won't answer if Charitonow junior is a moshichist , though you claim to be very anti.
I guess to you and yours the biggest moshichist is still better than the best non Chabadnik, echoing the well known and infamous chabad saying(rayatz) "inzereh zibuerhs iz beser fin zayer idehs"
Ilfi shehoitzi ess atzmoi vechileh
One of the biggest things that allowed the misnagdim to 'live with' the chassidish movement was the ability to carry on after the death of the Bal Shem Tov and magid.
Other groups were attached to their Rebbe and the chassidim never got over their death.
The only reason Chabad can't get over it is because the Rebbe was scared that if Chabad carried on after his death, he would be forgotten, especially as the successor would not be his offspring.
Even Hungarian Rebbes have ego issues.....
Interesting point, though no way of knowing if you are right so it's just conjecture.I wonder if there are others who have any other ideas why he did not hand pick a succesor, after all this is not Breslov, who has a whole philosophy over only R'Nachman as rebbe
The point made by Anon 8:41 was often quoted by misnagdish rabanim to prove the chassidim were different from Shabtai Tzvi like movements.
Today in many towns outside Israel the Breslovers are considered serious chassidim by learning chasidus and living with joy and the chabadskers are the crazy ones dancing on street corners.....
Tzig,I think you tripped up when you said that the Rebbe also honored the F.R after his passing.Cuz,basically that was what the poster wanted to get you to say.Honestly,I don't get this business either.Whatever the case I think Chabad rocks although there are heaps of nutty stuff going on there but it's easier than the expectations that you learn all day in yeshiva .Like this you get to be mekarev people and chill out a bit too.I used to go to a non Lubavitch yeshiva but though the learning was good it was very intense and I couldn't get up early for davening.Today I work and hangout in a Lubavitch inspired yeshiva-lite program
זייער שיין די הסברים פון הערשל ציר
"I notice that you won't answer if Charitonow junior is a moshichist , though you claim to be very anti."
If Jr. is someone''s mashpia do that mean the guy is a Mishichist too? even Helige people?
I don't see why Sholomm being or not being a Meshichist is an issue here
Hershel, maybe consider putting online a clip or two of Shamshon's nigunnim that might dispel all nonesense.
He was from the last of the Chabad ovdiim left. I had a chance to observe his daily davening in "770" and it was unique. Even great minds like Reb Yoel, Y. Friedman etc didn't compare to his durch geveikte avodas haTfila...
Mashichistim are apikorsim and shouldent be praised
"He was from the last of the Chabad ovdiim left."
did he zog Yechi at the end of his davening? I am seriously asking. And does Jr.? What does it mean if the answer is not the same?
Last meaning mah hoveh lanu?
Does anybody know if Charitinov jr is a Meshichist?
Who gives a crap if he's a moshichist? er iz an emese chasiddisher yid.
You "asked" who cares if Charitonov is a Meshichist.I do.I asked if anyone knew.You don't care so why would you see a need to respond?
"er iz an emese chasiddisher yid."
I think the question is whether one can be a truly G-d fearing Jew and a Meshichist.The RCA has banned Meshichists from becoming members and many hechsheirim will not condone shechitah done by a Meshichist.So yes, one can be well meaning, try their best but still be a geder of tinok shenishba.R'Chaim is famous for saying a "nebach apikores iz auch an apikores"
Chabad is a movement that believes in the Zohar and what ever Talmidie habesht said, the more these beliefs can be emphasised as reality the closer it is to its core belief, if you consider yourself more maskilish and sophisticated, then you can look for some MO group as Slifkin and his ilk, So if the Rebiem believed that the Rebiem never left their chasidim and their Beis hamedrash then chasidim are beliving it too and are ready to scream it loud and clear thru a microphone on the streets of Brooklyn. I remember the Satmer Rov saying by the establishment of Keren Hatzolah in the NY Armory that all the Rebbes that he clinched his Ideas too,are their in the hall, I dont remember that R Yitzchok Hutner should smirk at that statement or ridiculed it,looks like he wasn"t sophisticated as you and your pack of chabad haters.
Their is no secret that Chabad is out to influence every Jew Chariedi or Chiloni to learn the Belief system of the Rav and the teachings of the later Rebbes of Chabad, Reb Shulem Charitonef isnt hiding it, its as the Rambam writes if you love someone you will tell everyone to love him too, so dont try to make it some hidden agenda and you caught them.
Anonymous 11:55 and 12:02,
So you claim that Lubavitch is out there to rightfully educate the world about the truth as you put it:
"Their is no secret that Chabad is
out to influence every Jew Chariedi or Chiloni to learn the Belief system of the Rav and the teachings of the later Rebbes of Chabad"
So what would you do if Breslov, that equally believe that they are the correct path would open up shop in Crown Heights?
The rest of your post where you claim that :
"So if the Rebiem believed that the Rebiem never left their chasidim and their Beis hamedrash then chasidim are beliving it too and are ready to scream it loud and clear thru a microphone on the streets of Brooklyn."
is very "interesting" to say the least.So you claim that Chabad-Lubavitch believe that the Rebbe never left the bais hamedresh?Well official Chabad always claim NOT to accept that path, the path of the Meshichisten-Tzfas-Elokisten.They clearly state that that is not a legitimate view.So you are saying that they are just saying it fo public relations??
P.S I have a rebbe and no thanks I don't need you guys trying to "teach me" especially if those guys are on the level of the some posters here
you are talking foolish as if Crown Heights is New Square,it does not belong to Chabad and you can open Baptist churches and lehavdil breslover shtieblech from all styles Berland,Shick,Mermelstien,Schwartz, Arush etc...
Please ask your living Rebbe Zol Zein Gezunt (and make Malchusdiger chassunahs for all his kids and grand children and you should pay for it like a idiot)if believing in Hashoras Hanefesh and beliving that parents are coming(after passing on) to the simchas of their families, and that the Ropshitzer came(after his passing on) to the Sanzers hakofas, that Moshe Rebinie( after his passing on) came to the Yismach Moshes Hakofas, That Reb Yehoshoa of Belz was in Belzer Shull(after his passing on) by his son Reb Yisocher Dovs davening by the Omed and by Kvitlech,that Yakov Avinu(after his passing on) came to the Gra etc...
if this is Elokisten belief?
Reb chaim is not famous for saying that, he is famous for his new modern derech halimud of 2 dinim, it is just a small circle that he is famous with that statement since its all they are living for. and BTW reb chaim was no posek and I believe according to the Chasam Sofer who was a posek does not hold as Reb Chaim
What is wrong with you people that the first thing you do when you see praise for a lubavitcher you have to bash the chassidus in general and him in particular? Shiva isn't even over yet!
BTW Tzig, I thought lubavitch didn't do hespedim, or does online not count?
I see that Chabad is clearly hiding their attempts to make everybody into a Lubavitcher.
No thanks.Not nowadays for sure.Not into rebbe worship
Some of what Lubavitch does is commendable but I can't stand their sneaky way of trying to missionarize people and make them card carrying members.It's almost as if the head honchos their offer a reward for every scalp you bring them.Sure it's going to backfire
" Sure it's going to backfire "
is their a date???????????????????
Why does Oholei Torah allow young bocuhrim access to the 'net?
For the sake of accurate history: The Rebbe got Chosson Torah with the Frierdikeh Rebbe. The FR used to get it with his father and so lemaalo bakoidesh.
I have a inquiry for the webmaster/admin here at theantitzemach.blogspot.com.
Can I use some of the information from your blog post above if I provide a link back to this website?
Thank you for the outstanding posts
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